Jimmy Niner Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Hi guys. I'm reasonably new to CAS and am looking for an 1897 for WB. What is the difference between Cimarron, Norinco, and Interstate? It looks to me from what I have read so far to be the same manufacturer. Is this correct? If so, are they basically the same as far as workmanship is concerned? Thanks in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrimstoneJerome Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Interstate Arms CO. imports Norinco shotguns, so those are the same. I believe Cimmaron imports TTN 97s. My mileage is only with original Winchesters and Norincos/IAC they are bother great firearms. Word on the street is to not tangle with Kuandian(sp) which are 97s imported by Century Arms CO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Jake1001 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Hi guys. I'm reasonably new to CAS and am looking for an 1897 for WB. What is the difference between Cimarron, Norinco, and Interstate? It looks to me from what I have read so far to be the same manufacturer. Is this correct? If so, are they basically the same as far as workmanship is concerned? Thanks in advance. You forgot the most important name in shotguns. Winchester. They made 1,024 700. they are still out there for sale. Just sayin' Big Jake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Fill 'Em 67797 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Winchester #1 !!!! My buddy just grabbed a nice, original '97 for $175. They's out there. Check around your club, see if somebody has one to sell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder SASS #13056 Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 The best are generally newer IAC (formerly Norinco) and Winchesters. Real Winchesters are generally the smoothest, but many are pretty worn. So you have to check. Once you get a Winchester working well, they are usually a little slicer than the IAC/Norinco. And although the later IACs are generally quite good, quality can vary. But I've worn out two Winchesters in less time than I've been shooting my Norincos - and the IAC/Norincos with their harder steel seems to last much better. The TTN/Cimarron is also made in China in a different factory. They can be good, but like all inexpensive imports, the quality varies quite a bit. I've seen some that werre good and some that needed a lot of work. Cimarron may be watching quality a little better than previous importers, so I don't know. The good thing about the TTN is that they use American threads where the IAC uses metric. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Bullweed Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 I shoot original Winchesters as much as possible, including my 1897 takedown made in 1908. The original has a ratchet system that actually allows you to tighten the fit of the takedown device as the gun wears. I keep a couple of extra extractor springs and shoot it as often as possible. I am in the metal products business and travel to China on a regular basis. I have seen nothing in my mulitple visits to the country that promotes any level of confidence that they actual know of or care about quality metal work. I do not want their hammers, screwdrivers or pails and certainly would not like to hold their shotgun near my head while letting loose 10000 psi on the other side of questionable metal. This comment will likely stir much negative response but it is how this cowboy feels. If you doubt my thoughts on this, check out how thick the barrels on a SxS by IAC or TTN are; the makers use a lot of low-quality steel versus much thinner barrels of higher quality steel in an SKB, Browning, Stoeger or Biakal. Like another responder said, Winchester made over a million of these guns through 1955. There are some very neat deals out there for guns that have not seen much use. Many of these later shotguns were made for law enforcement and jail guard use; they might have some carry dings but will likely have seen few rounds down the barrel. I paid $475 for mine that came with two barrels: a 30" full and a 22" cylinder bore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Niner Posted July 28, 2011 Author Share Posted July 28, 2011 Thanks for all the feedback. I ordered a Norino/IAC today from CTD. I started to purchase a Cimarron, but whenI called the vendor, he told me the last two he sold were returned because they didn't work out of the box. I am interested in a Winchester, mostly for historical purposes. For CAS, I'd rather tear up an import. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dang It Dan 13202 Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 One more thing. If you are going to buy a Winchester, the models made in the 1950's seem to hold up to the wear and tear better. Some one told me that this is because the heat treating they were doing was much improved over the earlier models. I have, and still use (for big matches only now) the 97 I started with 14 years ago and it was built in the 50's. Look for one with a high serial number, like 1,000,000+, you may have to pay a bit more, but it will most likely outlast you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Dog, SASS #20401 Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 Right now the latest runs of the IACs are the best bet. The early runs which were called Norincos are not so good. If you can find a pristine original Winchester, then by all means go that route. I saw a pristine 97 made in 1999 sitting in the for sale rack at Long Hunter's shop yesterday for $795 and worth every penny, it was so gorgeous and almost "new". If I didn't already have 15 originals and clones, I would have had to put it on layaway. That's the problem, cowboy shooters have snagged up all the originals and bid up the prices. Most times these days if ye can find an original at a decent price, then it's a clapped-out beater. The Cimarron/TTNs were better in their earlier runs. Seems like here lately their quality/reliability/functionality has suffered. Do not under any circumstances buy a Kuandian imported by CIA (Century International Arms). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royal barnes sass #5792 Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 I just bought one of the Cimmarons (TTN) for use strictly in a few WB matches per year. Fit and finish are as good as any of the others. Action is OK and will get some work. It has gone boom everytime I have squeezed the trigger. My one complaint has been the length of the stock. It was way too long for me but that has been remedied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Dan,SASS#27235L Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 "You forgot the most important name in shotguns. Winchester. They made 1,024 700. they are still out there for sale. Just sayin'" Big Jake Interesting story: I have a 97 serial # 10172XX that was like new (99%) when I got it. About this time Norinco hired Coyote Cap as a consultant to help them improve the quality of their product. Cap, in fact, traveled to China to their factory a couple times. Any way, he knew I had this pristine 97 and asked me to ship it to him so it could be dis-assembled and every part measured by a machinist. He then sent the specs to Norinco and in their great wisdom the converted all the specs to.....metric! So, I guess my 97 is the grandpappy of the later Chinese 97's! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Jake1001 Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 "You forgot the most important name in shotguns. Winchester. They made 1,024 700. they are still out there for sale. Just sayin'" Big Jake Interesting story: I have a 97 serial # 10172XX that was like new (99%) when I got it. About this time Norinco hired Coyote Cap as a consultant to help them improve the quality of their product. Cap, in fact, traveled to China to their factory a couple times. Any way, he knew I had this pristine 97 and asked me to ship it to him so it could be dis-assembled and every part measured by a machinist. He then sent the specs to Norinco and in their great wisdom the converted all the specs to.....metric! So, I guess my 97 is the grandpappy of the later Chinese 97's! Cool story there Dapper Dan. I know that Winchester made the Model 1897 from 1897-1957 as a catalog item, but there was a parts clean up at the factory until 1959. I don't know how many, but probably a few hundred were ordered. Just sayin' Big Jake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackJack Daniels Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 I have had a couple of each. I have stuck with my real deal Winchester. They are available all the time on Gunbroker.com. The prices have gone down considerably in the last year. I prefer the solid receiver but I have seen both(takedown model) work well and hold up under pressure. Mine is over 100 years old and still works....there is something to be said about that!If you are patient you should be able to aquire one for the same price or cheaper than the Chinese imitation!I just sold one to a fellow cowboy for $300. Good Luck and Keep you powder dry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Whiskers Posted July 30, 2011 Share Posted July 30, 2011 I just heard yesterday that IAC/Norinco has shut down the factory and will not be making anymore 97's.They feel the market is flooded with them and original 97's now; and sales have dropped off to the point of not being worth it to stay open.So if anyone wants and can find a 97...grab it up...I have a feeling the once reasonable originals are going to get spendy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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