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You Make The Call


BJT

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Yes and you could make that argument very well for the saftey notch.

 

Now a review, PW, please correct me here...

 

Long ago, if a shooter brought up a rifle with the hammer at the safety notch, he was required to pull to full cock and fire. If it went boom, he was DQ'd and if it went click, no harm, no foul. Because of some incident, it was decided that this was an unsafe practice so a shooter was simply DQ'd if the rifle was on the safety notch.

 

 

What is unclear is the process if the hammer is on a cross bolt safety. The RO can do the same thing and DQ but many of you (ah hell, all of you) think he should be able to take the safety off and move on. Why? Why the difference?

 

I am claiming they should be treated the same, preferably with NO DQ DARNIT!!!

 

If going to full cock and dropping the hammer is not acceptable then unload at the line and return to the loading table.

 

There has to be a better solution that DQing people.

 

Done with sermon.

 

Have some lemonade and fried chicken.

 

Cheers,

BJT

 

I'm hurt...you obviously have me blocked...why else would you have not read my post?

 

:huh:

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Long ago, if a shooter brought up a rifle with the hammer at the safety notch, he was required to pull to full cock and fire. If it went boom, he was DQ'd and if it went click, no harm, no foul.

Because of some incident, it was decided that this was an unsafe practice so a shooter was simply DQ'd if the rifle was on the safety notch.

 

Almost correct. ;)

 

That issue came up during an ROC meeting...it was discovered that was NOT a "universally accepted" practice.

Further discussion generated the following clarification re: moving with a "cocked/loaded firearm":

 

22. Movement is not allowed with a loaded, cocked firearm. Movement is defined by the basketball “traveling” rule. Whenever a shooter has a loaded, cocked firearm in hand, at least one foot must remain in place on the ground. 1st violation will result in Stage Disqualification; 2nd violation will result in Match Disqualification.

This includes leaving the loading table with a cocked loaded firearm.

SHB p.24/RO1 p.19

 

Question (for anyone with an unmodified Marlin rifle)

On a stock Marlin...can the safety be engaged/disengaged with the hammer in the "rebound" position?

(IIRC, this can be done without manipulating the hammer...

I was going to check one of mine, but none of them have a functional crossbolt safety)

 

If so, then having the safety engaged would be irrelevant to assessing any penalty for failure to stage the rifle with the hammer FULLY DOWN...the hammer would be "at its final resting position" and NOT subject to any penalties.

** EDIT ** The Marlins do NOT have a rebounding hammer (see post #39 below) :blush:

 

Applicable definitions (RO1 "Glossary of Terms" - pp.30-31):

 

Cocked – hammer not fully down (full, half-cock or safety notch).

...

Hammer down – hammer fully down at its final resting position.

...

Loaded Firearm - Any firearm with unfired round(s) in the action/chamber/magazine.

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Question (for anyone with an unmodified Marlin rifle)

On a stock Marlin...can the safety be engaged/disengaged with the hammer in the "rebound" position?

(IIRC, this can be done without manipulating the hammer...

I was going to check one of mine, but none of them have a functional crossbolt safety)

 

 

Good question. And I am not sure. As our Marlin does not have a functional crossbolt either.

And has been that way for a LONG time. So don't remember for sure.

 

But seens I recall that it had to be that one little click back. (again. Not totally sure)

And if so. To me does not seem to be fully down.

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Good question. And I am not sure. As our Marlin does not have a functional crossbolt either.

And has been that way for a LONG time. So don't remember for sure.

 

But seens I recall that it had to be that one little click back. (again. Not totally sure)

And if so. To me does not seem to be fully down.

 

I believe you're correct...I just checked three different Marlins & NONE of them have a "rebounding" hammer...they all have a "safety notch/half-cock" position from which to engage the crossbolt.

In that case, the hammer would NOT be "fully down" with the safety engaged.

(I KNEW there was a good reason I didn't try replying to this one from w**k)

:rolleyes:

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PWB

 

Not sure I understand what your conclusion is as to Shooter 2. The definition of "cocked" and "hammer fully down" have to be read together and the first says the hammer is not fully down ONLY if it is in the full, half-cock or safety notch position. Is there a "safety notch" on a Marlin with a crossbolt safety? Is the conclusion that Shooter 2 was properly DQ'd? It is hard for me to understand the rationale for that result if safety is the objective of this rule. Thanks.

 

Cassalong Hopidy

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PWB

 

Not sure I understand what your conclusion is as to Shooter 2. The definition of "cocked" and "hammer fully down" have to be read together and the first says the hammer is not fully down ONLY if it is in the full, half-cock or safety notch position. Is there a "safety notch" on a Marlin with a crossbolt safety? Is the conclusion that Shooter 2 was properly DQ'd? It is hard for me to understand the rationale for that result if safety is the objective of this rule. Thanks.

 

Cassalong Hopidy

 

 

Not PaleWolf. And this is just my opinion.

 

But to me.

If nobody sees it before the shooter picks it up, and levers it.

Then I would not call it. Shooter #2 gets a reshoot.

Now. If someone sees it and calls it BEFORE the shooter picks it up and levers it.

SDQ.

 

Again. Just my opinion and I have been

wrong more than once or twice. :huh:

But the rule is fully down.

Don't matter that we agree with it or not.

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PWB

 

Not sure I understand what your conclusion is as to Shooter 2. The definition of "cocked" and "hammer fully down" have to be read together and the first says the hammer is not fully down ONLY if it is in the full, half-cock or safety notch position.

Is there a "safety notch" on a Marlin with a crossbolt safety?

Please reread post #39

 

Is the conclusion that Shooter 2 was properly DQ'd? It is hard for me to understand the rationale for that result if safety is the objective of this rule. Thanks.

 

Cassalong Hopidy

 

Refer to post #7

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I believe you're correct...I just checked three different Marlins & NONE of them have a "rebounding" hammer...they all have a "safety notch/half-cock" position from which to engage the crossbolt.

In that case, the hammer would NOT be "fully down" with the safety engaged.

(I KNEW there was a good reason I didn't try replying to this one from w**k)

:rolleyes:

 

 

More like, the hammer is fully down on the Marlin cross pin safety when the safety is engaged... and not fully down (if on that half cok notch) if the Marlins safety cross pin is not there when the safety is not engaged.

 

 

I checked my Marlin and you are correct, the hammer has to be at the half cocked position to engage the safety.

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