Please Make the Call

[Gold Canyon Kid #43974]

WITHOUT commenting on the stage writing or stage design, please make the calls in the following given scenarios:

 

Five pistol targets, of which three pistol knockdown targets are lined up straight in front of shooter one behind the other named 1 (closest), 2 (middle), and 3 (back). Adjacent are two fixed pistol targets (4 and 5) with about 1 1/2 yard between them. Stage instructions say shooter to knock down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order using 1st pistol rounds as necessary. Rounds remaining after three knockdowns are down in order, are to be placed on fixed target 4 and/or 5. Shooters verbally told that misses on knockdowns are not misses unless target still standing at end of string.

 

In a perfect world, shooter would knockdown targets 1 through 3 in order and finish with one hit on 4 and one hit on 5. Another acceptable scenario would be to use up all 5 rounds taking down targets 1, 2 and 3 in order, with no rounds left for fixed targets 4 and 5. Here are some alternatives to consider for making the calls:

 

Scenario 1. Shooter knocks down target 1, second magic bullet somehow hits target 3 (missing target 2), shooter then knocks down target 2, then hits fixed targets 4 and 5

 

Scenario 2. Shooter knocks down target 1 and 2 in order, hits target 3, it starts to fall and shooter moves on to hit target 4, sees target 3 did not fall, and goes back to knock down target 3.

 

Scenario 3. Shooter knocks down target 1, and 2 in order but none of remaining rounds take down target 3, it remains standing-no rounds on 4 or 5.

 

Scenario 4. Shooter knocks down target 1, 2, and 3 in order but hits target 5 then target 4

 

Scenario 5. Shooter knocks down target 1 and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter knocks down target 3, shooter then hits target 4, hits target 5 then with remaining bullet shooter hits target 4 again

 

Scenario 6. Shooter knocks down target 1, and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter misses 2nd shot, shooter then knocks down target 3, moves on to hit target 4 and 5 in order.

 

Scenario 7. Shooter hits target 4, hits target 5, then knocks down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order

 

Thanks, similar scenarios exist and spotters have to quickly make similar calls based on stage instructions.

[Snake River Clay SASS #34984]

WITHOUT commenting on the stage writing or stage design, please make the calls in the following given scenarios:

 

Five pistol targets, of which three pistol knockdown targets are lined up straight in front of shooter one behind the other named 1 (closest), 2 (middle), and 3 (back). Adjacent are two fixed pistol targets (4 and 5) with about 1 1/2 yard between them. Stage instructions say shooter to knock down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order using 1st pistol rounds as necessary. Rounds remaining after three knockdowns are down in order, are to be placed on fixed target 4 and/or 5. Shooters verbally told that misses on knockdowns are not misses unless target still standing at end of string.

 

In a perfect world, shooter would knockdown targets 1 through 3 in order and finish with one hit on 4 and one hit on 5. Another acceptable scenario would be to use up all 5 rounds taking down targets 1, 2 and 3 in order, with no rounds left for fixed targets 4 and 5. Here are some alternatives to consider for making the calls:

 

Scenario 1. Shooter knocks down target 1, second magic bullet somehow hits target 3 (missing target 2), shooter then knocks down target 2, then hits fixed targets 4 and 5 CLEAN

 

Scenario 2. Shooter knocks down target 1 and 2 in order, hits target 3, it starts to fall and shooter moves on to hit target 4, sees target 3 did not fall, and goes back to knock down target 3. CLEAN

 

Scenario 3. Shooter knocks down target 1, and 2 in order but none of remaining rounds take down target 3, it remains standing-no rounds on 4 or 5. 1 MISS

 

Scenario 4. Shooter knocks down target 1, 2, and 3 in order but hits target 5 then target 4 CLEAN

 

Scenario 5. Shooter knocks down target 1 and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter knocks down target 3, shooter then hits target 4, hits target 5 then with remaining bullet shooter hits target 4 again P

 

Scenario 6. Shooter knocks down target 1, and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter misses 2nd shot, shooter then knocks down target 3, moves on to hit target 4 and 5 in order. CLEAN

 

Scenario 7. Shooter hits target 4, hits target 5, then knocks down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order P

 

Thanks, similar scenarios exist and spotters have to quickly make similar calls based on stage instructions.

[Goody, SASS #26190]

1) Clean with a "P"

2) Clean

3) 1 Miss

4) Clean

5) Clean

6) Clean

7) Clean

[Adirondack Jack, SASS #53440]

WITHOUT commenting on the stage writing or stage design, please make the calls in the following given scenarios:

 

Five pistol targets, of which three pistol knockdown targets are lined up straight in front of shooter one behind the other named 1 (closest), 2 (middle), and 3 (back). Adjacent are two fixed pistol targets (4 and 5) with about 1 1/2 yard between them. Stage instructions say shooter to knock down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order using 1st pistol rounds as necessary. Rounds remaining after three knockdowns are down in order, are to be placed on fixed target 4 and/or 5. Shooters verbally told that misses on knockdowns are not misses unless target still standing at end of string.

 

In a perfect world, shooter would knockdown targets 1 through 3 in order and finish with one hit on 4 and one hit on 5. Another acceptable scenario would be to use up all 5 rounds taking down targets 1, 2 and 3 in order, with no rounds left for fixed targets 4 and 5. Here are some alternatives to consider for making the calls:

 

Scenario 1. Shooter knocks down target 1, second magic bullet somehow hits target 3 (missing target 2), shooter then knocks down target 2, then hits fixed targets 4 and 5 P

 

Scenario 2. Shooter knocks down target 1 and 2 in order, hits target 3, it starts to fall and shooter moves on to hit target 4, sees target 3 did not fall, and goes back to knock down target 3. P

 

Scenario 3. Shooter knocks down target 1, and 2 in order but none of remaining rounds take down target 3, it remains standing-no rounds on 4 or 5. ONE MISS

 

Scenario 4. Shooter knocks down target 1, 2, and 3 in order but hits target 5 then target 4 Clean

 

Scenario 5. Shooter knocks down target 1 and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter knocks down target 3, shooter then hits target 4, hits target 5 then with remaining bullet shooter hits target 4 again Clean

 

Scenario 6. Shooter knocks down target 1, and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter misses 2nd shot, shooter then knocks down target 3, moves on to hit target 4 and 5 in order. Clean

 

Scenario 7. Shooter hits target 4, hits target 5, then knocks down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order P

 

Thanks, similar scenarios exist and spotters have to quickly make similar calls based on stage instructions.

[Grizzly Dave]

WITHOUT commenting on the stage writing or stage design, please make the calls in the following given scenarios:

 

Five pistol targets, of which three pistol knockdown targets are lined up straight in front of shooter one behind the other named 1 (closest), 2 (middle), and 3 (back). Adjacent are two fixed pistol targets (4 and 5) with about 1 1/2 yard between them. Stage instructions say shooter to knock down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order using 1st pistol rounds as necessary. Rounds remaining after three knockdowns are down in order, are to be placed on fixed target 4 and/or 5. Shooters verbally told that misses on knockdowns are not misses unless target still standing at end of string.

 

In a perfect world, shooter would knockdown targets 1 through 3 in order and finish with one hit on 4 and one hit on 5. Another acceptable scenario would be to use up all 5 rounds taking down targets 1, 2 and 3 in order, with no rounds left for fixed targets 4 and 5. Here are some alternatives to consider for making the calls:

 

Scenario 1. Shooter knocks down target 1, second magic bullet somehow hits target 3 (missing target 2), shooter then knocks down target 2, then hits fixed targets 4 and 5

Assuming Target 3 fell when hit, Clean and a P

 

Scenario 2. Shooter knocks down target 1 and 2 in order, hits target 3, it starts to fall and shooter moves on to hit target 4, sees target 3 did not fall, and goes back to knock down target 3.

Clean and a P, target 4 was hit out of sequence

 

Scenario 3. Shooter knocks down target 1, and 2 in order but none of remaining rounds take down target 3, it remains standing-no rounds on 4 or 5.

1 miss

 

Scenario 4. Shooter knocks down target 1, 2, and 3 in order but hits target 5 then target 4

Clean

 

Scenario 5. Shooter knocks down target 1 and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter knocks down target 3, shooter then hits target 4, hits target 5 then with remaining bullet shooter hits target 4 again

Clean

 

Scenario 6. Shooter knocks down target 1, and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter misses 2nd shot, shooter then knocks down target 3, moves on to hit target 4 and 5 in order.

Clean

 

Scenario 7. Shooter hits target 4, hits target 5, then knocks down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order

Clean and a P

 

Thanks, similar scenarios exist and spotters have to quickly make similar calls based on stage instructions.

[Dubious Don #56333]

 

Thanks, similar scenarios exist and spotters have to quickly make similar calls based on stage instructions.

 

I wouldn't be able to make a call on any of those situations without consulting the Wire and PWB first...

[Willy Whiskers]

Scenario 1. This would be the same if #3 fell from vibration. The shooter had no target to shoot at with his 3rd round so he moved to the fixed targets. If he had just shot into the berm on #3 it would still have been fine. CLEAN

 

Scenario 2. This is a constant issue with fast shooters and knockdowns. It is the shooters responsibility to assure that his shot has had the desireed effect before moving on to the next target. CLEAN WITH P

 

Scenario 3. MISS

 

Scenario 4. CLEAN

 

Scenario 5. CLEAN

 

Scenario 6. CLEAN

 

Scenario 7. CLEAN WITH P was shot out of order

 

Thanks, similar scenarios exist and spotters have to quickly make similar calls based on stage instructions.

[Griff]

WITHOUT commenting on the stage writing or stage design, please make the calls in the following given scenarios:

 

Five pistol targets, of which three pistol knockdown targets are lined up straight in front of shooter one behind the other named 1 (closest), 2 (middle), and 3 (back). Adjacent are two fixed pistol targets (4 and 5) with about 1 1/2 yard between them. Stage instructions say shooter to knock down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order using 1st pistol rounds as necessary. Rounds remaining after three knockdowns are down in order, are to be placed on fixed target 4 and/or 5. Shooters verbally told that misses on knockdowns are not misses unless target still standing at end of string.

 

In a perfect world, shooter would knockdown targets 1 through 3 in order and finish with one hit on 4 and one hit on 5. Another acceptable scenario would be to use up all 5 rounds taking down targets 1, 2 and 3 in order, with no rounds left for fixed targets 4 and 5. Here are some alternatives to consider for making the calls:

 

Scenario 1. Shooter knocks down target 1, second magic bullet somehow hits target 3 (missing target 2), shooter then knocks down target 2, then hits fixed targets 4 and 5

"P", failed to engage target in specified order

Scenario 2. Shooter knocks down target 1 and 2 in order, hits target 3, it starts to fall and shooter moves on to hit target 4, sees target 3 did not fall, and goes back to knock down target 3.

no call

Scenario 3. Shooter knocks down target 1, and 2 in order but none of remaining rounds take down target 3, it remains standing-no rounds on 4 or 5.

one miss

Scenario 4. Shooter knocks down target 1, 2, and 3 in order but hits target 5 then target 4

clean

Scenario 5. Shooter knocks down target 1 and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter knocks down target 3, shooter then hits target 4, hits target 5 then with remaining bullet shooter hits target 4 again

"P", failed to engage target in specified order

Scenario 6. Shooter knocks down target 1, and with same bullet target 2 falls, shooter misses 2nd shot, shooter then knocks down target 3, moves on to hit target 4 and 5 in order.

"lucky", clean

Scenario 7. Shooter hits target 4, hits target 5, then knocks down targets 1, 2, and 3 in order

"P", failed to engage target in specified order

Thanks, similar scenarios exist and spotters have to quickly make similar calls based on stage instructions.

[Marauder SASS #13056]

For the first sited case, consider the following from the R.O. I book, Version L:

 

5-SECOND PENALTIES

Rifle, revolver, and shotgun targets must be engaged with the appropriate type of firearm. A "miss" is defined as the failure to hit the appropriate target type using the appropriate type firearm. Target placement should always allow a shooter the opportunity for a clean miss to be scored without argument. Overlapping targets of the same type should be avoided if at all possible and should not cause a Procedural "trap" by making it difficult to determine the shooter's intent when engaging the targets.

 

• Each missed target.

• Each unfired round.

• Each target hit with an incorrect firearm, either intentionally or by mistake.

• Each target hit with "illegally acquired" ammunition.

 

To help understand this concept, a "MISS FLOW CHART" is found in Appendix C. It is

also good to understand "A MISS CANNOT CAUSE A PROCEDURAL."

 

Now look at the Flow Chart in the R.O. I manual:

 

Before awarding a P, notice that it states:

Did target placement give the shooter the opportunity for a clean miss to be scored without argument?

 

If the answer to that question is NO, there is not procedure to be given.

 

I do not see clear instructions about how to shoot targets 4 and 5 since it says and/or.

 

So if the shooter has three shots left, how were they to shoot it?

 

Seems like you could give a P for shooting 4 twice just as easily as you could for shooting 5 twice or 4, then 5, then 4?

[Griff]

Marauder,

 

I agree with your caveat... however I took that "do not comment on stage writing or design" quite literally. So, I'd had to assume something... I chose to consider that all targets allowed a clear miss... although your assumption is clearly more likely.

[Marauder SASS #13056]

Griff, yup.

I posted because sometimes it is fun to set up a stage as described and the only targets available are like a falling plate or similar.

The rules now allow a reasonable way to deal with the situation.