Long Branch Louie Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 An article this morning states that "gun violence" is up in Greensboro, NC, due mostly because murders are up considerably. Some is blamed on arguments that spin out of control, and in general, it says all gun crimes are up. So there gonna form a task force committee to look at ways to reduce it. No mention is made of drug related killings. Why does the media insist on calling it gun violence? Is there a way to stop guns from behaving violently? Could we send them to obiedence school? IF I owned any guns, they would be well behaved and only fire when I wanted them to fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foard County News, SASS #77236 Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 Like you relate it might be interesting to see how drug related crimes have likely followed these gun deaths. It would also be wise to compare the entire murder rate and just the gun ones. The reason for the murders is much more important than just the means. If the perpetrator's motives are sound to the perpetrator merely removing one means will do little to the overall rate of murders. The other question since we do not have the original story is whether the rate was up or just the total number of gun homicides. Total numbers are statistically misleading. Further you also need to have a breakdown of the categories of murders. For example, in most jurisdictions justfied self defense that results in the death of the thug is still classified as a homicide. When reading statistics, besides reading what John Lott has written, check the February 2011 edition of "True North in Canadian Public Policy". In that edition the magazine of the Macdonald-Laurier Institute overviews problems with Canada's StatCan reliance on data provided by the Canadian legal system through JuriStat. One stunning observation the magazine noted, was that Canada was changing how crimes were categorized in ways that made the actual crime rates seem lower than the previous year. This also made it difficult to compare these categories with previous years' stats. It is doubtful that this would have received much attention except for the very aggressive prosecution of people refusing to fill out Canada's long form census (regarded as obtrusive). I found the publication an interesting read. Same kind of thing happened a year ago here where the paper reported the murder rate in Hammond was higher than Chicago. I found that hard to believe and checked the source documents. It took about a day of research, but I found that while what the reporter reported was true, the data was flawed. The data left out certain areas of Chicago, principally the highest crime ridden areas. With those areas left out, Hammond's murder rate was higher than either St. Louis or Chicago. But then again, the study only included St. Louis and not East St. Louis. In total the St. Louis(s) had a much higher crime rate than Hammond. Get yourself the facts and pen a letter to the editor. Get your friends to do the same. Stick to the facts and point out their errors... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Mountain Charlie SASS #43172 Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 You fellows are leaving out two important ingredients in the recipe. Most of the rants about "gun deaths" and "shootings" are hysteria related. They are either: 1. People that are not familiar with firearms, or 2. People that have an agenda about guns. The news reporting such incidents are looking for readership and subscription to their beliefs and ideas. In other words ignorance and $$$$ are the two ingredients. There are many other weapons that can induce death, Knives, baseball bats, screwdrivers, rocks, etc. You get the picture, I am sure. But because firearms require a certain knowledge and safety requirement, people that do not know these things attach a fear to them. Fear and unknown go hand in hand. A firearm usually attaches a loud noise to the action of shooting. Noise causes fear in some folks. Thunder is a good example. I have never heard of thunder doing any harm to anyone, but it causes some to cower in terror. I do not have any answers to the problem. The gun issue will go on for quite a while, I am sure. Just remember, WHEN GUNS ARE OUTLAWED, ONLY OUTLAWS WILL HAVE GUNS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Reb, SASS #54804 Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 GUESS I BETTER PRATICE UP ON THE OUTLAW CATAGORY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foard County News, SASS #77236 Posted May 8, 2011 Share Posted May 8, 2011 ...Most of the rants about "gun deaths" and "shootings" are hysteria related.They are either: 1. People that are not familiar with firearms, or 2. People that have an agenda about guns. The news reporting such incidents are looking for readership and subscription to their beliefs and ideas. In other words ignorance and $$$$ are the two ingredients... Well I don't disagree with you about your observations, but generally where the press is concerned you also need to realize where they get their training. Most of their training is done at college in Arts colleges. Writing, or in this case, wordsmithing is an art much like drawing or music. Those that write best tend to have a somewhat musical tone to their compositions and they seem to flow from concept to concept. Unfortunately, many of these same "artists" have very few skills in science, engineering, or business. Many times their compositions serve as testaments to their lack of skills in these areas. There is also the problem of journalistic laziness too. Rather than put a story aside to properly research an issue, they will just plow ahead report as gospel some poorly researched story. Case and point, and a personal favorite of mine was the science writer that wrote a story about biometric safeties on pistols. When the author wanted to show the evolution of safeties on pistols he pointed to the grip safety on 1911 pistol. The author asserted that the major reason for the grip safety was to prevent children from operating the firearm! If the science reporter had done any research at all he would have easily discovered the real reasons for the grip safety. One would think that your common sense would cause to research that claim further considering that the pistol entered service in 1911. Better still, the author's editor knew so little on the subject that the editor let it go to press. Of course, the premise of the article was that biometric safeties work reliably and wanted to show that such safeties were not new. The implications being that all firearms should have such safeties to prevent any unauthorized use. One of the lessons to draw from that is the importance of not letting such falsehoods stand unchallenged. In many ways the the Internet gives you the means of crying foul. Many of these stories have ways of providing feedback or challenging the author. But you must cry foul, and so must your friends. So get your facts together and present them to the editor or their readers (via a letter to the editor). You will be surprised the reactions you may get. BTW, the baseball bat argument I think is a poor one. A much better one is to ask them if the municipality is willing to put some skin in the game. Yhey want to sue the gun manufacturers don't they. Don't you think you should be able to sue the government for failing to protect you or your things? If they won't let you have an effective means of protecting yourself, shouldn't the municipality or the government assume both civil and criminal liability? Pose that question and see what the answer is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burt Blade, #25657 Posted May 8, 2011 Share Posted May 8, 2011 They are certain that if we ban guns, all those bad-behvaing people will become Kumbaya Koolaid Kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foard County News, SASS #77236 Posted May 8, 2011 Share Posted May 8, 2011 They are certain that if we ban guns, all those bad-behvaing people will become Kumbaya Koolaid Kids.I think for most of the hoplophobes that is true. Of course, they have not thought that out very well because if you are weaker than the thug, regardless of whether the thug is armed or not, you are extremely likely to lose. That is why you have to make them think. If they are so confident that getting rid of firearms will create that utopian society, have them put so money up. Have the government assume civil and criminal liability for failing to protect you or your things. Right now when they fail it is "so sad, so sorry." Everyone has to ask questions like that so that the media and others cannot ignore it. Then you can add how will you handle the next Katrina when many of us had to rely on personal firearms for our security until the situation stabilized... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Windshadow Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 the lemon squeezer safety hammerless .32 pocket pistols were marketed as safer in homes with children. the author in question should have pushed his research back a few decades from the 1911 to the guns that made the claim. I expect he ran across the claim somewhere out of context then asked some acquaintance who did some shooting for the info of what guns had grip safeties. Said friend had, I expect, little knowledge of technical firearms history I never cease to be amazed that when ever I read a news story about a subject where I have personal expert level knowledge how many errors will be un that story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Branch Louie Posted May 9, 2011 Author Share Posted May 9, 2011 the lemon squeezer safety hammerless .32 pocket pistols were marketed as safer in homes with children. the author in question should have pushed his research back a few decades from the 1911 to the guns that made the claim. I expect he ran across the claim somewhere out of context then asked some acquaintance who did some shooting for the info of what guns had grip safeties. Said friend had, I expect, little knowledge of technical firearms history I never cease to be amazed that when ever I read a news story about a subject where I have personal expert level knowledge how many errors will be un that story Doc, I agree 100%. Not just on gun issues, but occassionally I see a story about something I have personal knowledge of, and it is truly baffling how it can be so far off. Makes you wonder just how convoluted news stories are of things we are not familiar with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foard County News, SASS #77236 Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 ...I expect he ran across the claim somewhere out of context then asked some acquaintance who did some shooting for the info of what guns had grip safeties...What he was really trying to sell was the concept electronic biometric safety systems on firearms. He was attempting to use the grip safety as a supporting fact for his article by asserting its primary role was to prevent unauthorized use by children. All it really showed was just how poorly the article was researched. I think anyone who decided to research the history of the 1911 or its grip safety would not have spent more than 20 minutes and been able to put together a interesting section of the creation and evolution this system on the 1911. That is why it is important to write back to the news operation to have them correct such things. If nothing else it warns them if they say something dumb, the public will correct them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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