Kid Latham, SASS #79471 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 My main match revolvers are a pair of Ruger Blackhawks, for which I have both the .357 and 9mm cylinders. I also have about 600 rounds of 9mm ammo loaded with 124gr RNL that I’d like to use up. I’m wondering if this may be used for SASS local match competition. The only rule I’ve found in the handbook reads, “Must be in a caliber commonly available in revolvers. Examples include, but are not limited to, .32-20, .32 Magnum, .357 Magnum, .38 Special, .44 Magnum, .44-40, and .45 Colt” Who would have thought 20 years ago that we’d be seeing revolvers in 9mm, .40S&W and .45ACP? But, since there are now a few revolvers available in 9mm, would this be within the rules? I doubt that any of my local shooters would object, as there seems to be no competitive advantage involved, but am I pushing the envelope too far? Your comments appreciated. Thanks, Kid Latham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driftwood Johnson, SASS #38283 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Howdy You are going to get mixed answers on this one. The key phrase here is 'commonly available in revolvers'. 45ACP has been chambered in revolvers since 1917. No question, revolvers chambered for that caliber have been commonly available for a long time. I'm not sure how long 9mm and 40 S&W cylinders have been available for Rugers, but it is probably a reasonably long time. Before anybody can give a definitive answer, 'commonly available' needs to be better defined. Until that time, it's pretty much up for grabs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Coles SASS 1188 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 The 9mm cartridge was invented in 1902. Smith and Wesson currently produces the 940 in 9mm and produced the 547 (which is basically the Model 10 in 9mm and didn't take moon clips) 30 years ago. Taurus currently (?) makes the 905 in 9mm. Ruger currently makes the SP101 and the Blackhawk in 9mm. That is 5 revolvers sold in the US in 9mm that I know of, 4 in current production by what are probably the 3 biggest handgun brands in the US (S&W, Ruger and Taurus). Is that "commonly available"? I would think so. As you point out, there is no real advantage to the 9mm, so I don't see a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crosscut Jack, SASS #67759 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Hmm, how about a Browing Hi Power in the Wild Bunch match's. John Browning had felt that the HiPower was the best pistol that he had designed. Crosscut Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Canyon Kid #43974 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 I have shot a lot of 9mm bullets in my 357s. No one ever complained. I am sure if you asked your monthly match director he would say OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder SASS #13056 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 The first criteria is how fast are the bullets? They must be less than 1000 fps. At most local matches, I think they would allow you to shoot them if they meet the velocity criteria. A pointed, hard lead bullet at 1000 fps can damage targets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 They sure would look stupid in yore belt loops. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Dog, SASS #20401 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Go ahead. No one will care or say anything. Lots of folks already doing it. Long as the bullets are low velocity all lead no problemo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madd Mike #8595 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 My main match revolvers are a pair of Ruger Blackhawks, for which I have both the .357 and 9mm cylinders. I also have about 600 rounds of 9mm ammo loaded with 124gr RNL that I’d like to use up. I’m wondering if this may be used for SASS local match competition. Thanks, Kid Latham locally clubs can break all the (((((00000ps) bend all the rules they want ask, em then they say yes, (its no competitive advantage) that I know off shoot em up have fun share the story on the wire later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smuteye John SASS#24774 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 I seriously doubt that the targets will be able to tell that you are shooting a .356" 124 gr bullet from a 9mm case instead of a .358" 125gr bullet from a .38 if it makes minimum power factor but ain't over the velocity limit. Heck, it's coming out of the exact same gun and there's no competitive advantage that I can see with all the ballistic stuff being equal. Sounds like it's one of them "6 of one, half dozen of the other" sort of situations to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Reb, SASS #54804 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Commonly avail? its not as bad as that 45 special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Canyon Kid #43974 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Saw shooter shooting 45 acp at WR. Same loads as 45 cowboy special! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adirondack Jack, SASS #53440 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 The 9mm or .45 ACP are perfectly legal in all cartridge categories except Classic Cowboy (.40 or larger and rimmed required there) as long as they are loaded within the same specs as all other SASS ammmo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shenny Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 Other than one having a rimmed case & the other not, I don't see any difference between 9MM & 38 Short Colt Shenny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badlands Bob #61228 Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 I've done it before with my Blackhawks. However, stand by to catch some ribbing when you throw those 9mm rounds out on the loading table. There is no competitive advantage and as long as they are all lead and low velocity, you should be good to go. Give em something to talk about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan Cord Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 Sounds like you have a Nike response---- Just do it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowCatcher Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 The first criteria is how fast are the bullets? They must be less than 1000 fps. At most local matches, I think they would allow you to shoot them if they meet the velocity criteria. A pointed, hard lead bullet at 1000 fps can damage targets. Those are the same steel targets that we allow a rifle to hit at 1400 or so ? Could you explain that phenomena? Not being persnickety - but I'm having a mite bit of trouble here . . . . SC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 The 9mm or .45 ACP are perfectly legal in all cartridge categories except Classic Cowboy (.40 or larger and rimmed required there) as long as they are loaded within the same specs as all other SASS ammmo. That is the correct answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Junky Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 Those are the same steel targets that we allow a rifle to hit at 1400 or so ? Could you explain that phenomena? Not being persnickety - but I'm having a mite bit of trouble here . . . . SC I think he's referring to the round pointed bullets common with 9mm.....shouldn't be shooting pointed bullets out of a lever gun so even though the velocity is greater with the rifle the bullets are flat. I know we have targets that are pitted pretty deep and I can figure out why? Hard bullets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adirondack Jack, SASS #53440 Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 I think he's referring to the round pointed bullets common with 9mm.....shouldn't be shooting pointed bullets out of a lever gun so even though the velocity is greater with the rifle the bullets are flat. I know we have targets that are pitted pretty deep and I can figure out why? Hard bullets? Since most of us reload, there is nothin preventing a feller loading any lead bullets of any shape in 9MM cases. If he's got a pile of em, and has 9MM cylinders for his blackhawks. Nobody is suggesting using plated or jacketed bullets. Honest injun, in .380 or .38 Short Colt, I use the same bullets.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Foot Johnson Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 The 9mm or .45 ACP are perfectly legal in all cartridge categories except Classic Cowboy (.40 or larger and rimmed required there) as long as they are loaded within the same specs as all other SASS ammmo. Then there's the problem of 9mm, .40, and .45 acp often being referred to as having a rebated rim... protruding, flush, or rebated, it's still a rim! If nothing else, the description in Classic Cowboy would seem to be aimed directly at auto pistol cartridges, implying that they could be used in all other categories. I've used 9mm cylinders in Rugers before, as well as .40 S&W cylinders in my .38-40/.40 S&W Vaquero convertibles, and .45 acp in a Uberti 1873 .45 Colt with a convertible cylinder. (NOT in Classic Cowboy!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolan Kraps, SASS # 24084 Life Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 Hmm, how about a Browing Hi Power in the Wild Bunch match's. John Browning had felt that the HiPower was the best pistol that he had designed. Crosscut Jack And it is JUST that kind of thinking that will lead Cowboy Action Shooting down the slippery slope until we're shooting Cowboy Action Shooting matches with S&W 686's. No thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 Do it with style. Use black powder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diamond Dave Anthony Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 I'd be willing to wager that the "commonly available in revolvers" clause was to exclude the .30 Carbine in Ruger Blackhawks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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