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Chevy Volt fails to start during car show


Possum Skinner, SASS#60697

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From Glenn Beck Newsletter:

 

Chevy Volt fails to start during car show

 

Not only does the car not start, it's also not really electric. GM got massive government subsidies while covering up the fact that its gas power backup is actually more than a backup - it's on when the battery is low and when the car travels at highway speeds.

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

I love my '08 Sierra and think it's exceptionally well engineered, but because they took money from me without my consent, I will never buy another GM product. :angry: What a sham...shame.

 

Possum

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This from the Chevrolet website:

 

"Powered by electricity without being tethered to electrical outlets, the Volt does everything a great car does and, according to Motor Trend, better than any other."

 

I dunno, sounds like they're not really sayin' anything about the gas engine part of it.

 

Bystander

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This from the Chevrolet website:

 

"Powered by electricity without being tethered to electrical outlets, the Volt does everything a great car does and, according to Motor Trend, better than any other."

Bystander

That's a true statement. Unlike a hybrid, the gas engine doesn't kick in until the battery runs down. Chevy added the gas engine to allay fears that motorists would get stuck after 50 miles. An accurate fear, by the way.

 

No matter the product, no marketing info ever tells anyone the whole story. And there's just nothing new about this story.

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I have not been paying too much attention to it lately especially since you see them on the road now quite often in SE Michigan (and I no longer work for GM) but they have been talking about it's drive system for years now. Two years ago the marketing was 40 miles on battery power alone then the gas engine kicks to keep you going. GM even has a name for the concern about the battery power - "range anxiety"

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I know I'm about to open a can of worms, but so be it. I see a lot on here about people who say they will never buy another GM product because of the bailout. I would have rather seen them go thru a structured bankruptcy without the government being involved. I work for a large global company who is a major electrical and electronics supplier to the automotive industry. Fortunately, I'm in the consumer products side, but my colleagues on the automotive side have suffered greatly during the downturn and as a result of higher gas prices (READ, many jobs lost). If GM had failed, many, many folks besides the ones who work for them would have suffered. We supply but one part of the products that make a car. Millions would have been affected, unemployed people don't spend as much at Walmart, either. We're non-union, and I'm glad for that most of the time. GM made junk in the '70s, as did most US manufacturers. I've bought GM products all my life, and will continue to do so. I believe they will survive, and the money the government will lose will be money better spent in the long run than a lot they waste on other things. I know many of you will disagree with me, the whole thing rankled me, too, but there's a lot more people working today than there would have been if it hadn't happened....

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I'm a Jeep man so GM never really meant much to me. I think the volt is a start but it would never hold up where I live and I question its durability in extremely cold temps like we have here in the winter. I see nothing but problems.

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:FlagAm::FlagAm::FlagAm::FlagAm::FlagAm:

 

A General Gov't Motors product fails??----REALLY???

How ever could that happen?

 

BTW:

I have 50 shares of General Motors stock FREE to the first caller.

And I ain't kidding, neither.

 

Mustang Gregg

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I wanted to buy a new USA made car. I narrowed it down to small suv types with 4 bangers. The Chevy HHR, Dodge Caliber, Jeep Patriot, PT Cruiser and the Pontiac Vibe. All 2010's. I went with the Vibe mostly because it was a Pontiac (the last) and a good buddy of mine sells cars and cut me a pretty good deal. So the Vibe?? It's a Toyota Matrix made in Fremont,Cal. So I guess I have a USA, California made Pontiac Toyota. Ya gotta love it!:blink:

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I wanted to buy a new USA made car. I narrowed it down to small suv types with 4 bangers. The Chevy HHR, Dodge Caliber, Jeep Patriot, PT Cruiser and the Pontiac Vibe. All 2010's. I went with the Vibe mostly because it was a Pontiac (the last) and a good buddy of mine sells cars and cut me a pretty good deal. So the Vibe?? It's a Toyota Matrix made in Fremont,Cal. So I guess I have a USA, California made Pontiac Toyota. Ya gotta love it!:blink:

 

We have a patriot its a great little car Jeep. Of course I have a wrangler which is a great little real Jeep.

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:FlagAm::FlagAm::FlagAm::FlagAm::FlagAm:

 

As far as I know FORD has not taken any bailout money.

Chrysler (in past, at least) and GM have.

 

I support Ford over any others.

 

MG

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I support what will stay under me. My '97 chevy pickup has over 300,000+ miles on it and has been driven as hard as a vehicle can be driven. I've never had a Ford or Chrysler product hold up the way the GMs do. That's just me I assure you, but it is what it is.

 

The government has subsidised nearly everything we use at one time or another. You gonna quit eating because the govt. subsidises agriculture??? :blink::wacko::wacko:

 

Mustang Greg, I'll take that GM stock!! :D:D You know how to reach me. :lol::lol:

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FORD ;) Have had them all my life and won't have another - a true American auto/truck maker.

 

My mom's Cadillacs (a GM product) in the 80's and 90's were POS compared to her 60's and early '70's ones ~

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

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With Catherine's physical situation being what it is, we are limited to owning minivans. While I was as irritated as anyone else about Chrysler and GM taking the government payola from Obama (and that is exactly what it was), until Ford decides to get off their lazy butts and design a minivan with stow-and-go type middle seats, I have to stay with the Chrysler product.

 

Hey Ford, are you listening finally, you dumbbutts?

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GM sold stock and in essence a percentage of itself to the government. Chrysler only accepted loans and is paying horrendous (by today's standards) interest rates. With the government on the verge of shutting down it could be said that Chrysler is subsidizing the government.

 

As for the Volt being called an electric as opposed to a hybrid, I suspect it is a rating type of thing for instance caffeine free cola can have 1 or maybe 2% caffeine in it. So if a Volt's gas engine kicks in at a higher speed or lower battery charge than say a Prius then it is an electric and the Prius is a hybrid.

 

Along those same lines the government had incentive reimbursements for auto manufacturers to explore alternate fuels. The companies had to do the research and spend their own money then submit the data and paper work to be reimbursed. Chrysler had researched hybrid technology and advanced diesel technology. Before the paper work was submitted guess who decided that only "full" electric would be considered an alternate fuel.

 

I'm just saying,

 

Smoke

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With Catherine's physical situation being what it is, we are limited to owning minivans. While I was as irritated as anyone else about Chrysler and GM taking the government payola from Obama (and that is exactly what it was), until Ford decides to get off their lazy butts and design a minivan with stow-and-go type middle seats, I have to stay with the Chrysler product.

 

Hey Ford, are you listening finally, you dumbbutts?

 

maybe... http://www.ford.com/trucks/transitconnect/trim/?trim=xltwagonpremium

or maybe not :D

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

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In 1979 an individual converted a car to a hybrid electric that could get 90 miles per gallon.

 

http://www.motherearthnews.com/Green-Transportation/1979-07-01/Electric-Car-Conversion.aspx

 

1898

The German Dr. Ferdinand Porsche, at age 23, built his first car, the Lohner Electric Chaise. It was the world's first front-wheel-drive. Porsche's second car was a hybrid, using an internal combustion engine to spin a generator that provided power to electric motors located in the wheel hubs. On battery alone, the car could travel nearly 40 miles.

 

The Chevy Volt is using technology that is now well over 110 years old. What progress!!!!

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As far as I know FORD has not taken any bailout money.

Chrysler (in past, at least) and GM have.

 

I support Ford over any others.

 

Depends on how one defines bailout, i.e. government assistance. Ford just rec'd a nice $150 million dollar subsidy from the state of Missouri just to keep an assembly plant in Kansas City from moving to another state. I'm a business owner but I don't get any subsidies.

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Ok - I meant to reply to this yesterday.

The Chevrolet Volt is 100%, all the time, every single bit of it - electrically driven.

 

The confusion lies with the fact that the Chevrolet Volt is NOT 100% electrically charged from a wall plug in.

Electrical storage capacity (i.e. Batteries) will only allow moderate ranges of travel.

With a range of 30-60 miles, wholly electric vehicles like the GM EV-1, the Nissan Leaf, the Tesla Roadster and the Fisker Karma are boutique vehicles, these type of vehicles are only of use in consolidated urban centers with warm climates for people who will never travel more than 30 miles in day. Not the largest demographic of car buyers.

 

The Volt simply adds a gasoline engine to the charging equation. The Volt remains electrically driven, but when the battery charge falls below a certain level - the gasoline engine kicks on, NOT to drive the vehicle but to spin a generator to recharge the lithium battery pack.

This onboard generator allows the Volt to be driven as and treated like a "normal" car - no range anxiety.

If your trips are always short (as noted above), the gasoline engine does not regularly fire up (unless the gasoline in the tank becomes so aged, that the computer determines if you don't burn it up, it may go bad).

 

The Volt is not a gasoline powered vehicle, nor a hybrid - it is an electrical vehicle with onboard electrical generating capability.

On ANY electrical vehicle (Volt, Leaf, golf cart or radio controlled), something has to charge the batteries for operation, whether the electricty comes out of your outlet from a coal fired, water driven or nuclear powered electrical generator - or from an onboard electrical generator. The major difference being that if you run out of charge in a solely wall outlet vehicle - you will be walking and searching for the worlds longest extension cord. In the Volt, you will simply use the onboard generator to recharge and continue on your way without any delay, stoppages and noticible change in operation.

EV's are not perfect (and I don't know if they are even more than a short term band aid), but the closer they can be made to the norm, the easier it is to transistion some drivers into those vehicles.

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We have a patriot its a great little car Jeep. Of course I have a wrangler which is a great little real Jeep.

Sorry for the continued hijack.

 

I just had to tell my kindred spirit, MMJ, that we have a Liberty. It's a great little car/van Jeep. I can even park in compact car spaces and do, out of consideration for others. We also have a Wrangler, which is a great little Jeep.

 

I replaced a Grand Cherokee with the Liberty. All are/were 4WD.

 

It seems we always keep our vehicles 10 years or more. So, I guess I can't complain too much about them. The GC was 12 when the transmission went. The Wrangler is 10 and the Liberty is 5. Nice thing about Jeeps, they keep the same basic body style for years.

 

Just saying... ;)

 

Regards,

 

Allie Mo

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Depends on how one defines bailout, i.e. government assistance. Ford just rec'd a nice $150 million dollar subsidy from the state of Missouri just to keep an assembly plant in Kansas City from moving to another state. I'm a business owner but I don't get any subsidies.

 

Not quite the same type of federal bailout - it seems that Missouri (a state) is looking to give Ford a tax incentive to keep it's business in the state.

 

http://news.business...7HURTV3M06U947E

 

You may be a business owner, but if your business decided to go to another state would it have a major impact on the fiscal footprint of the state and it's people....

 

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

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YUP! and those that complain are out buying Italian made guns Japanese electronics etc.Kind of funny . :blink:

 

 

Dont forget the Swedish girlfriends.....shhhh dont tell my wife...

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Sorry for the continued hijack.

 

I just had to tell my kindred spirit, MMJ, that we have a Liberty. It's a great little car/van Jeep. I can even park in compact car spaces and do, out of consideration for others. We also have a Wrangler, which is a great little Jeep.

 

I replaced a Grand Cherokee with the Liberty. All are/were 4WD.

 

It seems we always keep our vehicles 10 years or more. So, I guess I can't complain too much about them. The GC was 12 when the transmission went. The Wrangler is 10 and the Liberty is 5. Nice thing about Jeeps, they keep the same basic body style for years.

 

Just saying... ;)

 

Regards,

 

Allie Mo

 

 

 

 

Ms. Mo:

 

Owner loyalty runs high among Jeep folks; we've had a Jeep in our garage since 1984 - Cherokee, 3 Grand Cherokees, and a Liberty. We are 10 yr keepers as well, usually running up 200K miles on a vehicle. Great cars, with none of the "reliability" problems voiced at various times in Consumer Reports (which I think is secretly owned by Japanese car makers :lol: )

 

I have a problem with all "electric" or "hybrid" electric vehicles - where is the environmental advantage? In electric mode, it might be quiet and emit no smoke, but somewhere, a power plant (or in the Volt) a gas engine had to operate to produce that electricity. Politicians and tree huggers talk about these vehicles like they are "clean", when actually they are just "cleaned" and the pollutents are discharged elsewhere. Call me when you have an electric vehicle of real-world capacity and safety that runs from solar, and we might talk...

 

In the meantime...where is the government on autogas (propane)? The cleanest burning available fuel, existing in abundence in the US, and rapidly growing in Europe and Asia as a primary motor fuel...but ignored by this Administration. Most existing auto engines can be easily and inexpensively converted to propane, eliminating the need to redesign entire vehicles. Geez...when do these guys get practical?

 

 

LL

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I know I'm about to open a can of worms, but so be it. I see a lot on here about people who say they will never buy another GM product because of the bailout. I would have rather seen them go thru a structured bankruptcy without the government being involved. I work for a large global company who is a major electrical and electronics supplier to the automotive industry. Fortunately, I'm in the consumer products side, but my colleagues on the automotive side have suffered greatly during the downturn and as a result of higher gas prices (READ, many jobs lost). If GM had failed, many, many folks besides the ones who work for them would have suffered. We supply but one part of the products that make a car. Millions would have been affected, unemployed people don't spend as much at Walmart, either. We're non-union, and I'm glad for that most of the time. GM made junk in the '70s, as did most US manufacturers. I've bought GM products all my life, and will continue to do so. I believe they will survive, and the money the government will lose will be money better spent in the long run than a lot they waste on other things. I know many of you will disagree with me, the whole thing rankled me, too, but there's a lot more people working today than there would have been if it hadn't happened....

Since we're not allowed to discuss politics on the wire, I won't even get started on the counter point to this bunch on bull. :wacko:

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There are at least 10 EVs on the horizon. The Volt was in the pipeline long before the bailout.

 

As much as people don't like to admit it the bailout worked. It kept lots and lots of people employed in thousands of businesses. I talked to a Ford exeuctive who said that if GM hadn't been bailed out they would have gone under along with Crysler and all the domestic foreign manufacturing plants because they all buy parts from the same bunch of parts manufacturers located all over the upper midwest. We are talking lots of good jobs. You remember good jobs don't you. Regular people used to have them and they paid good wages sufficient to support a family.

 

Anyway I root for the home team. Always have and always will. Last winter my wife and I bought a Chevy Traverse. I am happy with it, but it is a lousy commuter car. It sits in the garage until weekends.

 

Last fall we needed to replace our old Pontiac. My wife demands good mileage and figures prices are going up. We would have bought a Volt, but they aren't sold in our community. My wife and I leased a Prius. When the lease runs out we will get something American that gets great mileage. Maybe a Volt. By the way the Prius is a great commuter car, much better than I had anticipated.

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Hold on ....looks like FORD is doing some research along these same lines....

 

My link

 

:lol: I like the replacement tail lights....and the crutch visible through the left part of the rear window.

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

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We are talking lots of good jobs. You remember good jobs don't you. People used to have them and they paid good wages sufficient to support a family.

 

Yes I remember, 2008 was the last time I had a good one. Thanks for the bail outs :angry:

 

Jefro :ph34r:

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You may be a business owner, but if your business decided to go to another state would it have a major impact on the fiscal footprint of the state and it's people....

 

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

So what am I, chopped liver? When looked at as a group, independent businesses like mine have a far greater economic impact on state and local economies than large corporations like Ford etc. What we lack is the political clout and money to buy the favors lavished upon larger businesses at taxpayer expense. If you want to see the effect of small businesses leaving communities, take a look at rural America where towns are dead or dying. They're no less deserving than Ford. Since when is it necessary for government to prop up a business?

 

BTW, did you know you paid more in taxes last year than General Electric? They paid zero. Just sayin'... ;)

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When looked at as a group, independent businesses like mine have a far greater economic impact on state and local economies than large corporations like Ford etc. What we lack is the political clout and money to buy the favors lavished upon larger businesses at taxpayer expense. If you want to see the effect of small businesses leaving communities, take a look at rural America where towns are dead or dying. They're no less deserving than Ford. Since when is it necessary for government to prop up a business?

 

BTW, did you know you paid more in taxes last year than General Electric? They paid zero. Just sayin'... ;)

 

Key word - as a group...didn't say they (or you) are less deserving - of course not. I travel rural America alot, stay in small towns all the time - I see what's going on pard.

 

Anyway...the tax incentive for Ford is NOT a bail out - don't confuse the two. Tax incentives are huge to keep business' and I feel that should be applied to ALL business' - large and small...

 

Caterpillar was considering leaving Illinois over taxes, however they now say they are staying...I would venture a sizable wager that there was back room Chicago politics going on in that one ;)

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

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Yes I remember, 2008 was the last time I had a good one. Thanks for the bail outs :angry:

 

Jefro :ph34r:

 

 

Curious, how did the bailouts deprive you of a good job?

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Tax incentives...should be applied to ALL business' - large and small...

My point exactly, but it doesn't work that way. It's not a level playing field and the gulf is widening.

 

Bailout, subsidy, call it what you want, it's still the same -- taxpayer support of private enterprise. I don't think I'm entitled to it, and neither is Ford or Caterpillar.

 

My view from the lowest rung on the ladder.

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My point exactly, but it doesn't work that way. It's not a level playing field and the gulf is widening.

 

Bailout, subsidy, call it what you want, it's still the same -- taxpayer support of private enterprise. I don't think I'm entitled to it, and neither is Ford or Caterpillar.

 

My view from the lowest rung on the ladder.

 

Are views are the same, but different I guess...I don't think anyone is 'entitled' to anything...but a state, county, city should have the ability to offer incentives to compete for a business. At times people are voted in by their constituents for that purpose ~

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

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