Bustin Caps Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 I have a chance to buy a 1866 Navy Arms Saddle Ring Carbine. It is my understanding that Uberti was the maker of this gun. However,I cannot find the name Uberti anywhere on the gun. It just says made in Italy. I want to buy the gun if it is a Uberti, maybe not if it is something else. Any advice is appreciated as I am new to this sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiowa Kid, SASS #69870L Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 It is a Uberti, buy it. KK I have a chance to buy a 1866 Navy Arms Saddle Ring Carbine. It is my understanding that Uberti was the maker of this gun. However,I cannot find the name Uberti anywhere on the gun. It just says made in Italy. I want to buy the gun if it is a Uberti, maybe not if it is something else. Any advice is appreciated as I am new to this sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Navy Arms was one of if not the first importer of Uberti rifles. The real old ones had carriers that are 1.5" long. (There are also some other differences on the old ones.) All the current Ubertis have 1.6" carriers. Parts are no longer available for the "old" Ubertis so if it has the 1.5" carrier pass on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Fill 'Em 67797 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 I have a Navy Arms '66 and I love it. It was made by Uberti. As far as I know, If it is a Navy Arms it should be made by Uberti. Unless it is one of the real early ones with a 4 digit serial number ( or less) it should be a great rifle. I had a chance to buy one of the early ones and it did not look near as well made as the newer ones. Also, some of the parts don't interchange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 You may have to remove the forearm to look at the bottom of the barrel, under the wood. It's probably important on this gun to have a gunsmith or very knowledgeable CAS shooter take a look a that gun. Navy Arms was importing from Uberti back before Uberti standardized on the current frame size and carrier size and shape for the '66 rifles. I know, as my wife has an older Navy 66 that has a shorter than standard carrier and many of the parts are hard to find. (gun has been retired, essentially). Navy did not import guns from Italy from anyone but Uberti, if I remember right. But, just because its likely an Uberti does not necessarily make it a gun for which you can still get parts. Good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bustin Caps Posted February 15, 2011 Author Share Posted February 15, 2011 I have a Navy Arms '66 and I love it. It was made by Uberti. As far as I know, If it is a Navy Arms it should be made by Uberti. Unless it is one of the real early ones with a 4 digit serial number ( or less) it should be a great rifle. I had a chance to buy one of the early ones and it did not look near as well made as the newer ones. Also, some of the parts don't interchange. The serial number is 801 would this make it one of the ones i should not buy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Fill 'Em 67797 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 If that's the whole serial number, it might be best avoided. That's an early one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Lee Goode Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Bustin Caps You need to look up proof markes for date on that rifle / I have (2) of them great shooters. The only 2 parts hard to find are the carrier and the bolt all others can be had including a short stroke kit. GLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bustin Caps Posted February 15, 2011 Author Share Posted February 15, 2011 Bustin Caps You need to look up proof markes for date on that rifle / I have (2) of them great shooters. The only 2 parts hard to find are the carrier and the bolt all others can be had including a short stroke kit. GLG Where on the gun would I look for proof marks,date? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Lee Goode Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Under stock on the tang https://store.bluebookinc.com/Info/PDF/POWDER/MBPProofmarks.pdf GLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden A. Grudge Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 another thing to look at (that I learned about recently) is the lever itself. If it is the 1873 style lever as apposed to the original 1866 style lever, it is an early model. Probably not as definitive as looking at the proof marks but an easy thing to see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bustin Caps Posted February 15, 2011 Author Share Posted February 15, 2011 It is a Uberti, buy it. KK Where on the carrier do I measure to see if it is a 1.5' carrier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el Gato Gordo - SASS #15162 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 I have a Navy Arms '66 and I love it. It was made by Uberti. As far as I know, If it is a Navy Arms it should be made by Uberti. Unless it is one of the real early ones with a 4 digit serial number ( or less) it should be a great rifle. I had a chance to buy one of the early ones and it did not look near as well made as the newer ones. Also, some of the parts don't interchange. It is true that the older, 4-digit models do not interchange parts with the newer, and you may not be able to get parts for it. My '66 (probably built in the 1960's) had a longer carrier and was more sensitive to overall cartridge length. I needed to load to 1.49 to 1.53" overall length. That said, it was built BETTER than the current crop and never broke a loading gate in 10 years of hard, shared use. I would say to use this info as bargaining chips and go for it, understanding that with any rifle you will have to baby your cartridge length. Buena suerte, eGG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Where on the carrier do I measure to see if it is a 1.5' carrier From front to rear of the carrier. That 1.5" dimension is the length. See the attached photo. Left to Right. Original 66 in .44 Henry, old 1.5" Uberti, new 1.6" Uberti. http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee241/pettifogger1/P1000099.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Pat Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 I traded an extra m-1 carbine I had for a 1866 Navy carbine in 38 special about two years ago. It hung up all the time I Contacted Joe at PIONEER gUN WORKS LISTED IN THE sass LINKS ABOUT WORKING ON IT FOR ME. He immdiately told me I had an old one and the Italians made them to work with the 158 grain round nose police style bullets. he said he would make me the correct carrier and a correct short stroke kit and fit it all together for me and to send him the little carbine. He did a fantastic job got it right back to me and I have never had a problem with it. He did not charge me any extra over his regular prices and it is all now completely custom fitted. I can't brag enough on them, Irish Pat, sass 19486 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Kiowa Jones #6765 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Beside the differences in the carrier, bolt and extractor the earlier version of the 66 had this lever actuated trigger block. 66 WITH TRIGGER BLOCK As some have said the older gun will work just fine but if you buy it and plan to short stroke it send it to someone that knows them well. If the short stroke isn't installed properly you will have extractor problems and if you break it you are done. The only replacement will be a hand made part $$$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chantry Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 I have a chance to buy a 1866 Navy Arms Saddle Ring Carbine. It is my understanding that Uberti was the maker of this gun. However,I cannot find the name Uberti anywhere on the gun. It just says made in Italy. I want to buy the gun if it is a Uberti, maybe not if it is something else. Any advice is appreciated as I am new to this sport. I have one of the earlier ones as mentioned above. In hindsight, I would have been better off leaving it in the gun rack. Mine had a head space issue, a couple of parts related tot he trigger and trigger springs broke almost immediately. I was fortunate to have a gunsmith (since retired) who was able to fix everything at a very reasonable price. Also the sights on the real old models gave a poor sight picture. Unless this is a real bargain, meaning under $450, I'd leave it and save the money for a newer production model, either used or new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abe E.S. Corpus SASS #87667 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 A local gunsmith has one of these older '66 carbines in .38 Special on his used gun rack priced at $600 if anybody wants one. It is the only '66 I had seen with a lever safety. If interested PM me for details. It seems like it is just looking for a cowboy (or girl) to take it home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I'd avoid it like the plague... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Man Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I have several very early Navy arms 66s and have never had any problems. One of my favorate of all is a 66 carbine in 22 L.R. I have tried for years to find one in 22 Winchester mag and they are hard to find. Texas Man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I have several very early Navy arms 66s and have never had any problems. One of my favorate of all is a 66 carbine in 22 L.R. I have tried for years to find one in 22 Winchester mag and they are hard to find. Texas Man And when you do have a problem...you could have a real problem...and that's the problem. Everything's great if you don't have a problem... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Man Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Being in the Heavy Equitment Business, Heavy Constuction as I am, I know several good machinest that can repair or make just about anything. Also there are a number of good gunsmiths that can do the same when parts are no longer avalable. If one has a problem with any gun most of the time it is repairable and in some cases the repair will work better than the orginal part. Cost may be a matter of how much you like the gun and willing to spend on it. I had one shotgun that had a soft part from the factory and was made that way on replacement parts as well. After the secound time I had a machinest make a new part from start from a better steel and the problem went away. We in my business have a saying "After enought and sweet and blood and time everthing works". I also loved the sign I once saw in a speed shop across the wall in huge letters that just about summed it all up, "Speed cost money, How fast do You want to go". I quess custom guns can be the same. Texas Man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge Rufus Cornelius Colt #18386 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 The old ones have a different internal design and different springs than the newer models, and those springs are quite stiff. I'm told that these guns cannot be slicked up. Also, with parts breakage, you may have to have replacement parts custom made, which translates into a lot of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Kiowa Jones #6765 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Being in the Heavy Equitment Business, Heavy Constuction as I am, I know several good machinest that can repair or make just about anything. Also there are a number of good gunsmiths that can do the same when parts are no longer avalable. If one has a problem with any gun most of the time it is repairable and in some cases the repair will work better than the orginal part. Cost may be a matter of how much you like the gun and willing to spend on it. I had one shotgun that had a soft part from the factory and was made that way on replacement parts as well. After the secound time I had a machinest make a new part from start from a better steel and the problem went away. We in my business have a saying "After enought and sweet and blood and time everthing works". I also loved the sign I once saw in a speed shop across the wall in huge letters that just about summed it all up, "Speed cost money, How fast do You want to go". I quess custom guns can be the same. Texas Man So true, Back when every town had a gunsmith it was quite normal for him to make the parts. Back then if you were the town gunsmith you even had to make your own tools. Now days with our "I want it now" and throw-away mentality people automatically assume the parts are there in the back and all I gotta do is go get it and bolt it on. These folks just won't spend the money to fix it if they have to wait or if they feel the cost to make the part is too much. According to the National Shooting Sports Foundation there are only about 2000 full time gunsmiths left. With the stifling Government intrusion in to the gun business and this Wal-Mart "I want it now" mentality gunsmiths are going the way of the TV repair and Watch repair folks. On a side note, about 30 years ago I came on THIS OLD WINCHESTER 73. It was pretty loose and the bore was a mud road. Tightening thing up wasn't a big deal and even relining the bore. But, the extractor was broke. Back then no parts were to be had so I had to make one. That was my first venture into making spring parts. I still have that old gun and it still works just fine. I probably still have it because no one will pay me for the time I have in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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