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Shot timers


Grizzly Dave

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Other threads got me to wanting to know a bit more about them. I've never used one, so know pretty much nothing about them.

 

1) Are the current models of shot times better than those say 10 years ago? If yes, in what ways?

 

2) It appears that a good part of the suggestion that having the rifle last is not a good idea, is that the timer may have trouble registering a mouse fart load shot from a rifle which may be 3-5 feet away. Yet I've also seen some raise concerns that the timer picks up shots from wart hog loads from the next bay. Is that right?

 

3) Has anyone done any experiments with timers and mouse fart loads at the lowest possible SASS accepted power factor? I'm sure there is probably alot of variation in report based on powder used, caliber, etc, but it would interesting to see the results if anyone has done any experiments.

 

Feel free to tack on any timer related questions to this thread.

 

Grizz

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Other threads got me to wanting to know a bit more about them. I've never used one, so know pretty much nothing about them.

 

1) Are the current models of shot times better than those say 10 years ago? If yes, in what ways?...

 

 

Yes. Cost me 99 cents and is an APP for my iPhone.

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Yes. Cost me 99 cents and is an APP for my iPhone.

 

 

What APP do you have?

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The newer timers work a little better than the older ones. Some have added a sensitivity adjustment. Some changed the starting tone - which some cannot hear as well as the old. Some had improved Par times, memory and memory retrieval. But the old timers generally worked quite well.

 

It is always possible to pick up extraneous sounds when you have close bays. It can happen when there is a building or in the open. Plus sometimes the bras hits the timer and that shows as an extra shot. Not much that I know of to help those issues except be sure to watch the time and to cover the "port" when the stage is over.

 

When you set the sensitivity for lighter sounds, you increase the possibility of picking up extra noises. Where you hold the timer makes a big difference for lighter sounds as well. Some folks said that holding the timer close to the shooter's ear or a little higher seems to help pick up the sound. I've noticed the worse is either having it too low (seems the body blocks the sound) or when a prop (wall) won't let you get the timer close enough. (You don't want to get too close to the shooter and possibly distract or bump them as you may when shooting through a window.)

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Yeah, the iPhone app is probably OK but you may need to be careful if you plan to use it on iPhone 4 or the latest iPods. Those latter version have some enhanced noise cancelling firmware that CAN be problematic with these units. I have iPhone 3 and no problem with it.

 

The app is pretty slick and if you have errant ping or clang recorded you can easily remove it from the list.

 

The thing I like the least about it is that you cannot dump the sessions to a laptop or something to store and analyze your shooting sessions.

 

One other downside is that it is not a purpose built timer. If you have it on your iPhone your iPhone is pulling double duty. At least if you have it on the iPod you still have your phone while recording shooting strings.

 

Where they really need to go with this is to interface it with the more popular match software. It would be great that you could issue one to a posse with all their members in it and dump the results wirelessly to the scoring workstation...

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Other threads got me to wanting to know a bit more about them. I've never used one, so know pretty much nothing about them.

 

1) Are the current models of shot times better than those say 10 years ago? If yes, in what ways?

 

2) It appears that a good part of the suggestion that having the rifle last is not a good idea, is that the timer may have trouble registering a mouse fart load shot from a rifle which may be 3-5 feet away. Yet I've also seen some raise concerns that the timer picks up shots from wart hog loads from the next bay. Is that right?

 

3) Has anyone done any experiments with timers and mouse fart loads at the lowest possible SASS accepted power factor? I'm sure there is probably alot of variation in report based on powder used, caliber, etc, but it would interesting to see the results if anyone has done any experiments.

 

Feel free to tack on any timer related questions to this thread.

 

Grizz

The rifle issue probably applies to about half the loads being shot and are not necessarily those at lowest power factors. It is really more a function of the location of the timer and the muzzle of the rifle. If the TO keeps the timer tucked behind the shooter many rifle shots are missed.

 

I do find it interesting that you admit you have no knowledge of timers then in effect slam folks shooting SASS legal loads.

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I apologize if anyone feels that I've slammed them for shooting legal loads. That as certainly not my intent. For those that were, please consider "mouse fart loads" to mean "loads at the lower end of what is SASS legal." As long as they play within the rules, I personally don't care what they shoot, we all have different ways of enjoying the game.

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. ..Plus sometimes the bras hits the timer and that shows as an extra shot...

 

 

I have to admit that I love it when that happens! :wub:

 

There is so much one could do with this...alas this is a family venue.

 

Olen :P

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Other threads got me to wanting to know a bit more about them. I've never used one, so know pretty much nothing about them.

 

1) Are the current models of shot times better than those say 10 years ago? If yes, in what ways?

 

Can't answer that one Grizz, as ours are five years old and going strong (Competition Electronics Pocket Pro)

 

2) It appears that a good part of the suggestion that having the rifle last is not a good idea, is that the timer may have trouble registering a mouse fart load shot from a rifle which may be 3-5 feet away. Yet I've also seen some raise concerns that the timer picks up shots from wart hog loads from the next bay. Is that right?

 

From running the timer a lot, I have seen the timer fail to pick up some very light loads, but not nearly as often as some would lead you to believe. As far as adjoining bay shots setting off the timer, I suppose it could happen, especially on a common firing line that is close together, but I have not seen it. All of the bays at the clubs I shoot at are well separated.

 

3) Has anyone done any experiments with timers and mouse fart loads at the lowest possible SASS accepted power factor? I'm sure there is probably alot of variation in report based on powder used, caliber, etc, but it would interesting to see the results if anyone has done any experiments.

 

Nope, haven't done that, but you might want to watch how your timer responds to minimal 32-20 loads.

 

Feel free to tack on any timer related questions to this thread.

 

Grizz

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Griz,

I think there are way too many factors to do a study on what minimum load from a rifle would register.

My biggest problem with shots not registering is that dang piano prop at Pawnee. I usually hold the timer to the right side of the shooter. If we shoot standing just to the left of that piano, that would put the timer behind the piano, and shots can be lost. I have to make sure the timer is over the shooter or off to the left.

I have not seen shots from other bays set off the timer, but I am very conscious of covering the microphone as soon as the shooter is done.

 

GW

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Other threads got me to wanting to know a bit more about them. I've never used one, so know pretty much nothing about them.

 

1) Are the current models of shot times better than those say 10 years ago? If yes, in what ways?

Oh heck yes! I have been running with guns for more than three decades and have seen everything from watching the second hand on a wrist watch, to stop watches, to wired devices, to the modern devices we have now.

 

The main differences between timers now is size, ease of use and added functions. I like them meaty (and easy to read) like the CED Pocket pro, but CED makes a very small device (the 7000) that I see a lot. CED also makes what I consider to be the most unwieldy timer, the CED8000 which is a great training aid in dry fire practice.

 

PACT makes the Club Timer, which fits my hand just right, they also make an unwieldy thing called the MKIV championship timer. It is great for dry fire and has a chronograph built in, but, bulky for runnin'ngunnin'.

 

Cheap is the name of the game (very basic timer) for R.U. Ready, Speed Timer. Fairly small also and has a really loud buzzer! Hard to use as a dry fire timer but works well on the range.

 

2) It appears that a good part of the suggestion that having the rifle last is not a good idea, is that the timer may have trouble registering a mouse fart load shot from a rifle which may be 3-5 feet away. Yet I've also seen some raise concerns that the timer picks up shots from wart hog loads from the next bay. Is that right?

 

If you keep the speaker pointed at the gun, then cover it after the last shot you shouldn't have any trouble, even with .22's. I have seen a timer advance on the sound made by a falling slide on an auto pistol but have never encountered a problem with extra shots from next door. A heavy class ring can also cause an uptick though.

3) Has anyone done any experiments with timers and mouse fart loads at the lowest possible SASS accepted power factor? I'm sure there is probably a lot of variation in report based on powder used, caliber, etc, but it would interesting to see the results if anyone has done any experiments.

 

I have been at many matches with stages where the shotgun was first, the stage was shot by hundreds of folks with all sorts of calibers and loads and there were no contested instances that made the news. Maybe the match directors will chime in with their experience?

 

Feel free to tack on any timer related questions to this thread.

 

Grizz

 

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Yes. Cost me 99 cents and is an APP for my iPhone.

They don't appear to have a shot timer app for droid x

 

KDD

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I apologize if anyone feels that I've slammed them for shooting legal loads. That as certainly not my intent. For those that were, please consider "mouse fart loads" to mean "loads at the lower end of what is SASS legal." As long as they play within the rules, I personally don't care what they shoot, we all have different ways of enjoying the game.

There you did it again calling perfectly legal loads mouse fart loads. How to lose friends and influence in just a couple of posts.

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The biggest issue comes with the many clubs that shoot stages with no berms between them. They set the timer sensitivity so it does not pick up shots adjacent to them. When that happens it is very hard to pick up rifle shots, even many moderate rifle loads unless the timer is placed somewhere beside the shooter, in some cases bothering the shooter if not done properly. If someone wants to really understand the issue try timing a 22 rifle side match or even a speed rifle match.

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There you did it again calling perfectly legal loads mouse fart loads. How to lose friends and influence in just a couple of posts.

 

Where I've shot in Colorado, Wyoming and Texas, we laugh and joke about "mouse fart" loads and nobody takes offense, in fact the shooters who shoot lower power loads are often the first to call them mouse farts. We also laugh and joke about "dang Marlin" whenever ANY rifle jams or hiccups. There, I just lost some more friends I guess. Oh well, I reckon if that's all it takes to lose someone as a friend, they wouldn't have stuck around too long anyhow.

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Where I've shot in Colorado, Wyoming and Texas, we laugh and joke about "mouse fart" loads and nobody takes offense, in fact the shooters who shoot lower power loads are often the first to call them mouse farts. We also laugh and joke about "dang Marlin" whenever ANY rifle jams or hiccups. There, I just lost some more friends I guess. Oh well, I reckon if that's all it takes to lose someone as a friend, they wouldn't have stuck around too long anyhow.

Here we just make fun of old fat farts wearing black hats and long gray beards.

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I have never had a problem with my timer (CED 7000) picking up rifle shots, no matter how light they were. In fact just the opposite can happen, the timer may pick up the opening of the lever after your last shot, adding to your time. I always look at the last shot being recorded to be accurate.

Cash

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I have never had a problem with my timer (CED 7000) picking up rifle shots, no matter how light they were. In fact just the opposite can happen, the timer may pick up the opening of the lever after your last shot, adding to your time. I always look at the last shot being recorded to be accurate.

Cash

 

That timer should have a sensitivity adjustment. I'd say picking up the sound of a lever opening is way too sensitive.

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