Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 So I watched this movie "Proud" about the WWII Destroyer Escort USS Mason, the only combat ship with a black cre3w in WWII. Great story, slightly below average movie. Anyway, I looked up the history of the Mason. She was named after Ens. Newton H. Mason, a pilot killed in the Battle of the Coral Sea in 1942. The keel was laid for the Mason on October 14, 1943 in the Boston Naval Yard. She was launched on November 17, 1943. That's right 34 days. They built a destroyer escort in a month!! She was commissioned in March. The Nazi's and the Rising Sun didn't have a chance. USS Mason DE-529 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Great photo! Let's also remember the 'Liberty' ships while were at it. They were a great example of 'get em out' productivity as well...they had their share of problems, but they also helped win the war! God bless ALL the shipbuilders that 'got her done'... GG ~ U*S*A flag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugs Bonney SASS # 10171 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 How about six million M1 carbines turned out by folks that had never produced a gun before. Bugs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 9, 2011 Author Share Posted February 9, 2011 How about six million M1 carbines turned out by folks that had never produced a gun before. Bugs And how 'bout those Chrysler built Shermans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spooky Joe, SASS #24061 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 And look at the 10s of thousands of aircraft built during the war years. Name a product, tanks, trucks, ships, weapons, whatever. The numbers are staggering. And all that without union work rules, EPA restrictions, OSHA, etc. The only thing that even approaches that degree of productivity was the Levittowns built after the war. Yes, they were identical ticky-tacky (as the song goes), but they were bought as fast as they could be built so the average worker could own his (or her) own home. I'm afreaid we'll never see the likes of that again. In 1999 a company called Arizona Clean Fuels LLC proposed building an oil refinery on 1400 acres in Yuma, AZ. Today this much needed facility is no closer to construction that it was then. And don't even think of a nuclear power plant. I doubt if I'll see one built before my grandson has grandchildren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willie Wheelgun Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Ford built a B-24 in less than one minute! My uncle was a guest on a DE in the South Pacific. They were so small, they repaired them at sea. He never touched land from 1942 to 1945! He went through eleven typhons and the last one washed him overboard. He was picked up on an aircraft carrier and transferred back. He didn't have enough money to bribe them to leave him on the big ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellowhouse Sam # 25171 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 What with all the enviros, regulations, and what not I don't even think they could build the Interstate highway System today. Ike got it done in short order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Slick, SASS #64415 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Thanks for posting Utah Bob, a Navy Man, I love ships of all kinds. What can we do today? Take a long look at the U.S.S. New York, we can do it again and again. Ship Ahoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Not sure why, but that all made me think of the Battle off Samar and "Taffy 3." Talk about G-U-T-S!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loophole LaRue, SASS #51438 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 I understand that the nature of warfare has changed, but I can't help but wonder if we could duplicate this level of productivity today. With so much of our heavy manufacturing gone, and the complexity of armaments so greatly increased, could we meet a sudden threat that required 10 or 20 times the existing capacity to manufacture? I'm thinking about how scarce brass and bullets got a year ago, and just what industries still exist that could be converted to wartime production. Our shipyard capacity is greatly reduced (and narrowly specialized). Interesting post, UB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugs Bonney SASS # 10171 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 There is a book about this topic called "Brute Force" some of you might like to read. I don't remember the stats exactly but it points out things like Japan started the war with,I think six Aircraft carriers and the US with three in the Pacific. Durring the war they built another six and we buile something like 146. There is a story about a German officer who was in charge of an 88 in Italy who knocked out seven or eight Sherman tanks in a pass before being over run. In his interrigation he simply told them that he was taken because he ran out of ammo before we ran out of tanks. It's a great book that really puts all this into perspective. Bugs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Other great production feats can include the making of the best fighting men and women to grace our armed forces at that time! GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noz Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Let's see here: Our vegetables come from south America and China Our fruit comes from south America and the far east. Our beef comes from Argentina. Our electronics come from the far east. Our clothing comes from China Our shoes come from Mexico and the far east. Our automobiles come from China, Japan, Korea and Europe. Our Auto Parts for our nobly American made cars all come from China. We have bought into the idea that the Toyota plants here make the Toyota an american car. The profits all go to Japan. Our energy source is the near east Iron ore can be mined in Michigan, loaded on ships, hauled to Japan, refined down to sheet metal and shipped back to Detroit cheaper than we can make it here. Our children are notably behind the Asian countries in levels of education. Our children are far behind in physical development. Our workers produce less per hour than any of the "modern" countries. For crying out loud, Our toy guns come from Italy and Russia with some fine Turkish ones thrown in. I'm a printer and I can buy paper from Indonesia and Germany made with US wood pulp cheaper than I can buy American made stuff. Most of my ink comes from Holland. Yup, we are truly a most productive people now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 9, 2011 Author Share Posted February 9, 2011 I understand that the nature of warfare has changed, but I can't help but wonder if we could duplicate this level of productivity today. With so much of our heavy manufacturing gone, and the complexity of armaments so greatly increased, could we meet a sudden threat that required 10 or 20 times the existing capacity to manufacture? I'm thinking about how scarce brass and bullets got a year ago, and just what industries still exist that could be converted to wartime production. Our shipyard capacity is greatly reduced (and narrowly specialized). Interesting post, UB. Hard to say really. At first glance one would doubt it but I suspect that before the war most would have bet that a country struggling to come out of a whopping depression would not have been able to accomplish what they did. The Japanese and Germans sure didn't. I remain optimistic that America can still rise to challenges although there's a tendency to wring our hands and moan "Woe is us". I didn't start the thread for that purpose, just to remind us all and maybe emphasize how great this country was...and is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Hard to say really. At first glance one would doubt it but I suspect that before the war most would have bet that a country struggling to come out of a whopping depression would not have been able to accomplish what they did. The Japanese and Germans sure didn't. I remain optimistic that America can still rise to challenges although there's a tendency to wring our hands and moan "Woe is us". I didn't start the thread for that purpose, just to remind us all and maybe emphasize how great this country was...and is. Yup - damn right! GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Slick, SASS #64415 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 We haven't lost our touch, we are still a great Nation.We have the best of the best Military and production is what we do best. We just need to roll up our sleeves, settle our differences and get to work. The old saying, Divided we Fall, United we stand That was an awefull cold looking pik there Bob, thanks for sharing. MS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadeye Doug Dalton SASS#65449L Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 So I watched this movie "Proud" about the WWII Destroyer Escort USS Mason, the only combat ship with a black cre3w in WWII. Great story, slightly below average movie. Anyway, I looked up the history of the Mason. She was named after Ens. Newton H. Mason, a pilot killed in the Battle of the Coral Sea in 1942. The keel was laid for the Mason on October 14, 1943 in the Boston Naval Yard. She was launched on November 17, 1943. That's right 34 days. They built a destroyer escort in a month!! She was commissioned in March. The Nazi's and the Rising Sun didn't have a chance. USS Mason DE-529 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Mason_(DE-529) http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/sh-usn/usnsh-m/de529.htm http://www.navsource.org/archives/06/529.htm http://www.accessmylibrary.com/coms2/summary_0286-29867268_ITM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oklahomabound Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Let's see here: Our vegetables come from south America and China Our fruit comes from south America and the far east. Our beef comes from Argentina. Our electronics come from the far east. Our clothing comes from China Our shoes come from Mexico and the far east. Our automobiles come from China, Japan, Korea and Europe. Our Auto Parts for our nobly American made cars all come from China. We have bought into the idea that the Toyota plants here make the Toyota an american car. The profits all go to Japan. Our energy source is the near east Iron ore can be mined in Michigan, loaded on ships, hauled to Japan, refined down to sheet metal and shipped back to Detroit cheaper than we can make it here. Our children are notably behind the Asian countries in levels of education. Our children are far behind in physical development. Our workers produce less per hour than any of the "modern" countries. For crying out loud, Our toy guns come from Italy and Russia with some fine Turkish ones thrown in. I'm a printer and I can buy paper from Indonesia and Germany made with US wood pulp cheaper than I can buy American made stuff. Most of my ink comes from Holland. Yup, we are truly a most productive people now. ...and our debt,which is beyond belief, is financed by China. We really and truly own nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foul Mouth Frank Shutz Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 In WWII we had two advantages which helped with productivity: (1) The Mafia wanted the Facists out of Sicily and helped the war effort to that end by keeping the unions in line. (2) The communist wanted the Soviet Union rescued from their alliance with the Nazis and ceased overt anti-American activites for the duration. In neither case did either party cease activites deem not harmful to the war effort, (crime for the Mafia, espionage for the communists). We have not had either of these advantages since. Consequently we haven't won a war in 65 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bama Red Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 That DE was a good looking ship. Todays ships are all slab-sided and hardly look real. I know they have a whole lot more firepower and the slab sides are armor to reduce vulnerability to missiles and such, but, dangit, they are sure ugly!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Slick, SASS #64415 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 That DE was a good looking ship. Todays ships are all slab-sided and hardly look real. I know they have a whole lot more firepower and the slab sides are armor to reduce vulnerability to missiles and such, but, dangit, they are sure ugly!! New ships are a new breed..called Stealth and fire power beyond any dreams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 That DE was a good looking ship. Todays ships are all slab-sided and hardly look real. I know they have a whole lot more firepower and the slab sides are armor to reduce vulnerability to missiles and such, but, dangit, they are sure ugly!! The F-22 is butt ugly compared to a Mustang....but alas, time marches on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 The F-22 is butt ugly compared to a Mustang....but alas, time marches on. I couldn't agree more! Or the Lightning, or perhaps the coolest looking plane ever, the Spitfire. (Not just my opinion, ranked number one "sexiest" airplane by a flying magazine.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 I couldn't agree more! Or the Lightning, or perhaps the coolest looking plane ever, the Spitfire. (Not just my opinion, ranked number one "sexiest" airplane by a flying magazine.) I remember a commercial back in the 70s that Triumph ran. They had a guy driving a Spitfire down the runway as a real Spitfire blasted by. The voice over said "Like your first love, you never forget your first Spitfire." Always loved that commercial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I remember a commercial back in the 70s that Triumph ran. They had a guy driving a Spitfire down the runway as a real Spitfire blasted by. The voice over said "Like your first love, you never forget your first Spitfire." Always loved that commercial. I was a youngster way back then, but I vaguely remember that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I think this is the one: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I couldn't agree more! Or the Lightning, or perhaps the coolest looking plane ever, the Spitfire. (Not just my opinion, ranked number one "sexiest" airplane by a flying magazine.) The 'coolest' looking aircraft in my book is the F16. Never liked the looks of the Spitfire...however, I thought the Junkers Ju 87 Stuka was one mean looking machine! GG ~ U*S*A flag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 I think this is the one: Thanks Doc. That's the one!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 The 'coolest' looking aircraft in my book is the F16. Never liked the looks of the Spitfire...however, I thought the Junkers Ju 87 Stuka was one mean looking machine! GG ~ U*S*A flag JU87 was one butt ugly flying machine. The coolest looking fighter jet all time hands down is the F-86. I will listen to no argument about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 The 'coolest' looking aircraft in my book is the F16. Never liked the looks of the Spitfire...however, I thought the Junkers Ju 87 Stuka was one mean looking machine! GG ~ U*S*A flag Funny, I would rather see an A-10 over an F-16 any day of the week! Of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and as a ground pounder, a Warthog is a beaut! Pretty darn mean looking in its own right as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spooky Joe, SASS #24061 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 As Doc Ward said "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder". Many's the time I asked for some assistance and an F-4 or A-6 came by and reported "I'm 30 seconds to bingo fuel. Where do you want it?" Then there was the beautiful A1E. His "Guess I can stick around for a while. Got plenty of hard rice. What can I do you for?" was beautiful music to my ears. Those birds with their tails on fire might have their place, but give me a few A1Es any day. From what I understand the Warthog is almost as efficient as far as us groundpounders are concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugs Bonney SASS # 10171 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Somehow, with all the loss of industrial potental, we still field the best Military in the world. The M1 Abrams tank, the F22 Raptor fighter and B2 Bombers, The supercarriers and submarine service boats and the Marine Corps are all the best in the world. But, the lesson from history is that although at the beginning of WW2 the same could be said for the Germans. It simply doesn't matter if the F-22 can shoot down 100 planes to every one it loses if the odds are 250 to 1 The same holds true for the other weapons mentioned. If you can't replace your losses faster than they occure, you lose. Bugs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Funny, I would rather see an A-10 over an F-16 any day of the week! Of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and as a ground pounder, a Warthog is a beaut! Pretty darn mean looking in its own right as well. The A10 is also a fantastic and aggressive looking aircraft, but I'd still take an F16 over that if we are talking 'looks'. They have competely different jobs to do, and they both do their intended purpose quite well. Since you mentioned the Spitfire, of WWII, I had to bring up the Stuka of the same era...beauty is in the eye of the beholder - alas. GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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