Wif Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Recently I saw a post somewhere that the 2010 IAC 97's where much better than the older ones. I was shopping today for a Wild Bunch shotgun and my local dealer has a 08 in stock and his distributor has no stock left on the 2010 models. Is there enough difference between the 08 and the 10 models that I should wait for a 2011 model? Wif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Wif, I can't answer your question from any first hand knowledge of the 10 series but I have a couple of the 09 series and they were pretty good straight from the box. Beautiful wood, strong and relatively good action. Best regards ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fargo Bill, SASS #4942 Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Recently I saw a post somewhere that the 2010 IAC 97's where much better than the older ones. I was shopping today for a Wild Bunch shotgun and my local dealer has a 08 in stock and his distributor has no stock left on the 2010 models. Is there enough difference between the 08 and the 10 models that I should wait for a 2011 model? Wif Just be patient, shop around, keep your eyes open and spread the word that you are looking for a 97 and you will come up with an original and can forget the wonder about the foreign models. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Meadows,SASS#28485L Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I saw no difference between the 08 and 09 models. I ran 4 or 5 of each through my shop and they were both very good right from the box. Johnny M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wif Posted January 19, 2011 Author Share Posted January 19, 2011 Thanks Johnny your advice helps a lot. I think I'll go with the 08. I'll be in Heber visiting family right after Winter Range. I'll try to stop by your store. Wif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezekiel J. Rivers Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Newbie question here but how do you tell the year of manufacture on these shotguns? Are there any years that are known to be problematic? I have a '97 but I like to have back-ups for everything. I'm a little too Type-A for my own good sometimes. Best regards. Zeke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wif Posted January 19, 2011 Author Share Posted January 19, 2011 EJR For the IAC models of the 97 the first two digits of the serial number are the year. 08=2008, 09=2009 and so on. For a real Winchesters Google "Winchester serial numbers" and you will come up with serial number date of manufacture cross reference. Wif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Bullweed Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Winchester made over a million '97s. The matches that I attend show that the best '97 shooter are usually shooting originals. These can be found for under $600. I have worked in the metal product industry for over 25 years and visit China on a routine basis for manufacturing evaluations. I will never understand buying Chinese over original, American or European. I want a gun made by shooters who understand what happens if the metal is too soft/hard or if the internal locking items do not exactly fit. China is the last place on earth to find those workers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Dog, SASS #20401 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Well, TB how many of each do you have? I have an even dozen original 97s. All are take downs and each is a bottomless money pit. I have spent thousands of dollars trying to keep them running but they refuse to keep doing so. My former favorite quit me twice in the same Regional. My Chinese trombone guns on the other hand are all solid frames made of better steel and have been pain and trouble free. My Chinchesters go out to play CAS and WBAS. The originals stay in the safe. I cannot afford to campaign them and continue to contribute to my gunsmith's kids' college fund and his retirement account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 From conversations with several dealers, the IAC 97s were not produced in the 10 series, as the number of 09's imported were sufficient for most of 2010, and the factory has been busy producing some other (unspecified) line of guns. Good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Woodrow Cahill, SASS # 54363 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 GJ - they're probably churning out these ... http://world.guns.ru/assault/ch/type-95--qbz-95-e.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outlaw Gambler Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Lone Dog, I can't speak for anyone else but my wife and I each have an original 97, mine is a takedown with a 500,000 serial number and hers is a solid frame with a 600,000 serial number. In 2000 I sent mine to a well known 97 gunsmith in MN for an action job and check over. I have shot it in every match for ten years (except for one match I tried an 87) with out a single problem and it has never been back to any gun smith since 2000. My wife's was sent to the same gunsmith and his son did the action work on it in 2001. He took a little too much off the sear and I had him replace it while at a shoot in MN. It did not fail, we caught it before it failed. She has shot it with out a problem since 2001. We have both won our state championship divisions with these two 97's. Now to address someone having 12 or 20 97's and none of them work sounds a little fishy to me. I deal in 97's and FFL documentation that I have over 400 original 97's thru my shop in the last 10 years. Granted some were not as good as others but even some of the worse ones worked really great once they were smithed by someone that knew which end of the barrel to aim at the target. It gets me to wondering how much, if any, PROFESSIONAL gunsmithing were done on your dozen 97's and what condition were they in when you started with them? If you tell me they were all in really good condition and just broke when you used them, I have a challenge for you. Send two of them to a good gunsmith that specializes in 97's and see if that doesn't make a difference. Or, get ahold of me and I would like to discuss purchasing your non working parts guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 It gets me to wondering how much, if any, PROFESSIONAL gunsmithing were done on your dozen 97's and what condition were they in when you started with them? If you tell me they were all in really good condition and just broke when you used them, I have a challenge for you. Send two of them to a good gunsmith that specializes in 97's and see if that doesn't make a difference. OG - You know, I've done that exact experiment. I've sent a take-down Win 97 to one of the top of the game CAS gunsmiths because it would not eject. Came back with no better functioning than when I sent it out. Nope, I had not done any tinkering out it. I sent out an older Norinco 97 that had been fired maybe 1000 rounds in its lifetime (another CAS pard got it new, and hardly ever shot), asking for a rebuild on it because it would not eject and the action bound up about every fifth cycle. Came back with some pretty good gunsmith advice from another of the top 97 smiths - it's not worth fixing when there are new IACs being imported which work much better. "Perfect" 97 gunsmithing is rapidly becoming a lost art, as far as I can tell. So, what did I do? Grabbed a new production IAC, gunsmithed on it a little myself, and so far it has run like a tightly wound Swiss watch. Good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Dog, SASS #20401 Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Well Gambler, I admit none of the dirty dozen have been to see Squibber or Cap or Joe Briscoe. BUT my gunsmith is a great gunsmith. He can fix anything. He can make parts from nothing if he ain't got one which he almost always does. He tells everyone else he is a year behind. He makes exceptions for me as I am a good tipper and I would feel guilty paying him only what he asks because for some strange reason he does not charge what it is worth. Every time he fixes something on an original, something else breaks. The nature of the beast, they are old and were rode hard and put up wet for decades before I acquired them. But none are "parts guns". And none are for sale. When I get retired I will learn how to fool with them myself and carry a tool box of spare parts. None are for sale. I still have "hopes" for each of them and they are what they are, originals. There will never be any more. I'm glad you have been lucky with originals. I have not. Meanwhile, my intention is to ride the Chinchesters hard and put 'em up wet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Woodrow Cahill, SASS # 54363 Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Considering that Winchester made over a million of them and they've been used everywhere from sanitary skeet ranges to battlefields across the globe is a testament to their design and durability. However, even the newest of them is over 50 years old and old things tend to break. And we do tend to run our guns a little hard. Anybody lucky enough to find one that isn't all clapped out has a real gem. I have a 1955 made one that functions flawlessly, and I admit to babying it to keep it that way. I had one of the original Chichester 97's - it was something of a rattletrap. It got sold off, and now based on reports of improved workmanship I'm in the market for a new one. I checked the Davidsons website, and they don't seem to be available right now. Plus, I was over on the S&W forum, and it appears the '97 is on the hit list of shotguns the ATF wants to ban because of the "sporting purposes" canard. Are they going to be available at all in the future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outlaw Gambler Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Lone Dog, part of the problem may be with your gunsmith. I too used one that was older (80's) that had a complete machine shop, could make any part you wanted, did excellent work. I had some of the same problems you are experiencing, put a new part in, repair a part, whatever. Bottom line was the gun was not dependable for any length of time. After talking to, and having work done, with about every 97 gunsmith in SASS I found and and understand that a single part can't be changed and expect the gun to function properly unless you go thru the gun and tune the entire action so it works in accordance with the rest of the parts. One new part and the rest old parts results in one of the old parts breaking because the new part puts extra stress on some of the old parts. Example, if you need to put a new plunger spring in you may as well put all new extractors and springs and be done with it. Hope this helps and you get a 97 up and running as there is nothing better than shoot an original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder SASS #13056 Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Just to be sure about a IAC, the latter ones can all be good, but either make sure you can handle the gun to check it out or be allowed to return it. IA pard got one about a year ago and the gun could not be taken apart. The Mag. tube was very stuck. I feared I would break or bend it if I tried further. Since it was from Davidson's, he returned it and they sent another of the same model. That was was very nice. Just reduced the main spring a little and it was ready to go. I've found that the IAC's seem to help up longer for me than nearly all the original Winchesters. Seems the metal last longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Dog, SASS #20401 Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Considering that Winchester made over a million of them and they've been used everywhere from sanitary skeet ranges to battlefields across the globe is a testament to their design and durability. However, even the newest of them is over 50 years old and old things tend to break. And we do tend to run our guns a little hard. Anybody lucky enough to find one that isn't all clapped out has a real gem. I have a 1955 made one that functions flawlessly, and I admit to babying it to keep it that way. I had one of the original Chichester 97's - it was something of a rattletrap. It got sold off, and now based on reports of improved workmanship I'm in the market for a new one. I checked the Davidsons website, and they don't seem to be available right now. Plus, I was over on the S&W forum, and it appears the '97 is on the hit list of shotguns the ATF wants to ban because of the "sporting purposes" canard. Are they going to be available at all in the future? Only the bayonet lug equipped trench gun is on the ATF hit list so far. Regular 97 no problem so far. Heavy emphasis on the "so far". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.