Otis Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Hi There, I am Otis from Pueblo West, Colorado. I find this Cowboy Action shooting very appealing. My son and I watched a match at the local range this summer and were amazed! I am currently purchasing firearms and will work on my outfit and rig once I am heeled. I have the two pistols. My question is regarding the Rifle. Is barrel length a big factor. The rifle I am interested in comes with an 18" or 30". I am thinking the 18" is the way to go. What do you all think? Regarding the shotgun, I like the side by side, which is better, with hammers or hammerless? Thanks!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Howdy Otis. Welcome! the number 1 priority with the rifle is to insure you get one that will hold 10 rounds in the mag tube. Beyond that, opinions will vary on length, caliber, make, etc. It will boil down to what feels good to you on YOUR shoulder. I have little to say on the SG because I've seen some mighty fine shooters use both types. I use a 97 (pump) but alot of Top Guns love the SxS, both hammer and hammerless. Hope this helps ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Otis - Whoa, man. Before you start spending your dough, go back to a match and start trying the guns. The level of your questions tells me you don't know enough about the various options, shooting categories and lots of other details to be satisfied with what you are starting to buy. Some folks can live with buying a set, selling them off and buying another set that actually works. Maybe you can too. I sure wouldn't want to! Pards will be REAL happy to let you try lots of various guns out. Rifle - tremendous difference between an 18" carbine and a 30" rifle. Neither of which are the most popular length - a 20" short rifle. The main problem with an 18" gun is that you may not be able to load 10 rounds in the mag tube. It will get old fast if you can't, and you have to stop shooting the common 10-shot rifle string to stuff in one or two extra cartridges. Almost NO one shoots a 30" rifle for main match in CAS. Too heavy, too slow to get on target, and it hits window frames and doorways on stage sets. If the rifle you are looking at can't be ordered by your gun supplier in a 20 or 24 inch, I would be very surprised, and I would be very suspicious that the supplier is just trying to peddle guns to you that he can't otherwise move to more experienced CAS shooters. Hammerless SxS shotguns are faster. Classic Cowboy category requires hammered SxS shotgun. You have to have a good idea of the category you will shoot in order to make good choices about the guns and the cartridges. You get that knowledge by GOING TO A MATCH and ASKING TONS OF QUESTIONS. If you buy just based on the hundreds of opinions you get from this Wire, you will almost certainly not be buying what YOU need, but what SOMEONE ELSE NEEDS for their category and shooting style and motivation. Good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Branch Louie Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Otis - Whoa, man. Before you start spending your dough, go back to a match and start trying the guns. The level of your questions tells me you don't know enough about the various options, shooting categories and lots of other details to be satisfied with what you are starting to buy. Some folks can live with buying a set, selling them off and buying another set that actually works. Maybe you can too. I sure wouldn't want to! Pards will be REAL happy to let you try lots of various guns out. Rifle - tremendous difference between an 18" carbine and a 30" rifle. Neither of which are the most popular length - a 20" short rifle. The main problem with an 18" gun is that you may not be able to load 10 rounds in the mag tube. It will get old fast if you can't, and you have to stop shooting the common 10-shot rifle string to stuff in one or two extra cartridges. Almost NO one shoots a 30" rifle for main match in CAS. Too heavy, too slow to get on target, and it hits window frames and doorways on stage sets. If the rifle you are looking at can't be ordered by your gun supplier in a 20 or 24 inch, I would be very surprised, and I would be very suspicious that the supplier is just trying to peddle guns to you that he can't otherwise move to more experienced CAS shooters. Hammerless SxS shotguns are faster. Classic Cowboy category requires hammered SxS shotgun. You have to have a good idea of the category you will shoot in order to make good choices about the guns and the cartridges. You get that knowledge by GOING TO A MATCH and ASKING TONS OF QUESTIONS. If you buy just based on the hundreds of opinions you get from this Wire, you will almost certainly not be buying what YOU need, but what SOMEONE ELSE NEEDS for their category and shooting style and motivation. Good luck, GJ +1 for what Joe said. I've only been at this a year, folks bent over backwards to help me, most will let you try their guns. Depending on which rifle you choose, they get pretty pricey so feel good about the first one. Go to some more matches, learn more about what catagory you want to shoot and whether smokeless or black. Try guns, ask questions and certainly get many opinions. Worry about clothes last, a cowboy hat and some boots will get you started, nobody will look down on you because you are not yet fully outfitted. Most of all, BE SAFE and have fun!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jefro, SASS#69420 Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Otis - Whoa, man. Before you start spending your dough, go back to a match and start trying the guns. .If you buy just based on the hundreds of opinions you get from this Wire, you will almost certainly not be buying what YOU need, but what SOMEONE ELSE NEEDS for their category and shooting style and motivation. Good luck, GJ Howdy Otis and Welcome, what Joe said, before you spend another dime start going to some local macthes. Most folks will be more than willing to let you try out thier gear. Give the MD a call before hand and they my be able to have a set of guns avalible for you to shoot a match. Good Luck Jefro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher Carson Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 What they said, Otis: Get thee to a match. Everyone will compete to let your try their guns. There isn't really always a "best" in the grand scheme of things, sometimes not even a "better." Lots of "it depends" and mostly that's about your own preferences. Welcome aboard! -Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckshot Frank Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 I, like you, am just getting started. I went and watched a match and knew that it was something tht I wanted to do. I went ahead and bought my pistols because I knew Rugers were the safe choice and they were on sale. I also went out and bought a Stoeger because I knew I wanted a double barrel over the '97 and figured that the hammerless should be faster than a hammered version. I figured that I couldn't really go wrong with those choices, so I wasn't worried about buying before I try. I'm not going to buy a rifle, however, until I try the different options ('73, Marlin, or Rossi). Also, I won't feel bad about borrowing one gun, but I wouldn't want to borrow everything (although folks would be more than happy to loan you anything needed). If you have any question about what you want, it's probably best to go shoot a match before buying. Plus, there is a good chance that someone at your local shoot might have a gun or two to sell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Junky Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 I like the short rifles for sure 18 inch rifles or 19 inch carbines. If you are real tall you may prefer a 20 inch but as others have said try one first so you see what feels right for you....Welcome to the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost, SASS #50125 Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Hi There, I am Otis from Pueblo West, Colorado. I find this Cowboy Action shooting very appealing. My son and I watched a match at the local range this summer and were amazed! I am currently purchasing firearms and will work on my outfit and rig once I am heeled. I have the two pistols. My question is regarding the Rifle. Is barrel length a big factor. The rifle I am interested in comes with an 18" or 30". I am thinking the 18" is the way to go. What do you all think? Regarding the shotgun, I like the side by side, which is better, with hammers or hammerless? Thanks!! Hello Otis. This is Ghost from Texas. Let me invite you to consider "Classic Cowboy" as your shooting catagory. "Classic" is the elite catagory of CAS. A group of us Classic Cowboys have started an award program to honor selected classic cowboys with the "Classic Cowboy Shootist Award". You do not have to be a World Champion to recieve this award, just be willin' to shoot Classic. Look in the SASS HANDBOOK for all the requirements to shoot Classic, but in a nut shell the following: 1. 40cal or larger pistols and rifle. 2. Rifles can be a '66 or '73 models. 3. Shotguns can be a '87 level or 12ga hammered double. 4. Shooting style is duelist or double duelist. 5. Must wear aleast 5 items of a 15 or so list. See HANDBOOK. Check it out and let's have a little fun. Ghost (I shoot .45 Rugers, Uberti '73 with a 20" barrel, and TNN 12ga hammered double) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Hello Otis. This is Ghost from Texas. Let me invite you to consider "Classic Cowboy" as your shooting catagory. "Classic" is the elite catagory of CAS. A group of us Classic Cowboys have started an award program to honor selected classic cowboys with the "Classic Cowboy Shootist Award". You do not have to be a World Champion to recieve this award, just be willin' to shoot Classic.Look in the SASS HANDBOOK for all the requirements to shoot Classic, but in a nut shell the following: 1. 40cal or larger pistols and rifle. 2. Rifles can be a '66 or '73 models. 3. Shotguns can be a '87 level or 12ga hammered double. 4. Shooting style is duelist or double duelist. 5. Must wear aleast 5 items of a 15 or so list. See HANDBOOK. Check it out and let's have a little fun. Ghost (I shoot .45 Rugers, Uberti '73 with a 20" barrel, and TNN 12ga hammered double) He meant '87 Lever... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Howdy and welcome to the fire! If I might make a suggestion, try getting ahold of some local pards and watching a match or two and maybe trying out stuff with them before buying anything. You have several really good clubs on the Front Range and tons of great pards to spend a little time with, (any of whom will help you till the cows come home) If you go to the SASS home page, click on "Affiliated Clubs", then Colorado, it will bring up a list of clubs near to you. You might want to give El Gato Gordo a hollar as he is close, runs a good match and is a pretty nice guy. I think (best check) that the Sand Creek Raiders club restart in February or March and they have a lot of great cowboys and cowgirls out there. With a little drive I think (best check) that the Pawnee Station folks are still shooting this time of year. Grizzly Dave might check in and he would know. Again Welcome!! Regards Gateway Kid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Duncan Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Howdy Otis. Welcome! the number 1 priority with the rifle is to insure you get one that will hold 10 rounds in the mag tube. Beyond that, opinions will vary on length, caliber, make, etc. It will boil down to what feels good to you on YOUR shoulder. I have little to say on the SG because I've seen some mighty fine shooters use both types. I use a 97 (pump) but alot of Top Guns love the SxS, both hammer and hammerless. Hope this helps ..........Widder Widder is a good cowpoke to listen too...he's a giving you good advice too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost, SASS #50125 Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 He meant '87 Lever... Phanton , yup. Ghost (Who loves "Classic Cowboy") Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otis Posted January 5, 2011 Author Share Posted January 5, 2011 Hello Otis. This is Ghost from Texas. Let me invite you to consider "Classic Cowboy" as your shooting catagory. "Classic" is the elite catagory of CAS. A group of us Classic Cowboys have started an award program to honor selected classic cowboys with the "Classic Cowboy Shootist Award". You do not have to be a World Champion to recieve this award, just be willin' to shoot Classic.Look in the SASS HANDBOOK for all the requirements to shoot Classic, but in a nut shell the following: 1. 40cal or larger pistols and rifle. 2. Rifles can be a '66 or '73 models. 3. Shotguns can be a '87 level or 12ga hammered double. 4. Shooting style is duelist or double duelist. 5. Must wear aleast 5 items of a 15 or so list. See HANDBOOK. Check it out and let's have a little fun. Ghost (I shoot .45 Rugers, Uberti '73 with a 20" barrel, and TNN 12ga hammered double) What part of Texas? I spent seven years in Waco. Sure do miss Texas. I plan to attend the up coming shoot in Rock Vale. Will do as you all have advised. I have a set of .45 Rugers. "Classic Cowboy" - I'll have to check it out. Thanks!!! Otis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Welcome Otis! You have great advice. Garrison Joe and Widder always seem to give great advice. You are going to have so much fun, especially if your son joins you. Unless he's very tall and you are rather short, you will not want to share long guns, especially the Shotgun. The butt stocks should be cut to fit. You can share pistols though. Let us know what what you end up with. Regards, Allie Mo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MMJ#89586 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 I'd say look and handle each gun your thinkinkg about buying the choose. For me I like around a 20 inch barrel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G. P. Cobb Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Does Classic Cowboy eliminate the 92 and the Marlin? If so then you can't shoot a 66-73 in B Western? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Bullweed Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 I have been doing this for four years and am still learning. I suggest printing out the SASS handbook and really reading the main match and category rules. Visit another match and ask a posse leader or range officer who you should talk to. Many clubs have new shooter days where you can try different guns. Large (state and regional) macthes often have vendors like Talor's selling guns at the match. Leather is critical. You can always resell a gun; leather is another matter. You need to select your category and guns before you buy leather. I have '60 Henry, '73s (original and Uberti), '92s (original and Rossi) and modern Marlins. I am fond of the '92s in the field, but they can be intolerant of oal in SASS. The toggle lock (Henry, '66 and '73) are the guns used by teh fastest shooters. Marlins are great guns but have to have be worked to be match-ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horace Patootie, SASS #35798 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Hammerless doubles usually need some action work to make them drop open and stay open while at the same time cocking the internal hammers. Most of these guns are pretty stiff when new. I have never used a hammer double but would like to try one, preferably the TTN or equivalent. I also have a '73 lever gun in 45 Colt with a 30" barrel. It's a fun gun. It is commonly believed however that a 20" barrel rifle is the most popular because of balance and maneuverability. Horace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blazen Vaquero, SASS 69509 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Howdy and welcome to the fire! If I might make a suggestion, try getting a ahold of some local pards and watching a match or two and maybe trying out stuff with them before buying anything. You have several really good clubs on the Front Range and tons of great pards to spend a little time with, (any of whom will help you till the cows come home) If you go to the SASS home page, click on "Affiliated Clubs", then Colorado, it will bring up a list of clubs near to you. You might want to give El Gato Gordo a hollar as he is close, runs a good match and is a pretty nice guy. I think (best check) that the Sand Creek Raiders club restart in February or March and they have a lot of great cowboys and cowgirls out there. With a little drive I think (best check) that the Pawnee Station folks are still shooting this time of year. Grizzly Dave might check in and he would know. Again Welcome!! Regards Gateway Kid Otis, You've received a lot of good advice so far. The Sand Creek Raiders have a "New Shooters Clinic" scheduled for April 17 at our range in Byers. I think last year we charged $15-$20 and you will shoot any of our guns (probably over 50-75 of all different types) and it includes all the ammo you will shoot too. We have folks who have never picked up a gun in their life to experienced shooters. We have a stage set up to try also with absolutely no pressure. If you just can't wait, which I understand, we will have our Cabin Fever Match January 23 (weather permitting-what for info on our website) and then begin the 4th Sundays from March thru October and any 5th Sundays along the way. If you really can't wait then Colorado Cowboys in Lake George is another great place to go shoot. As a matter of fact I can't think of a club or the folks where it isn't. If you want to find our club or others, go to www.sandcreekraiders.com (sorry don't know how to insert a link here) and you will see how to get to "Other Clubs" also. You can also email or PM me if you need more details. Good Luck Cowboy it's always great to hear from others who have discovered this great SASS community. Blazen Vaquero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost, SASS #50125 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 What part of Texas? I spent seven years in Waco. Sure do miss Texas. I plan to attend the up coming shoot in Rock Vale. Will do as you all have advised. I have a set of .45 Rugers. "Classic Cowboy" - I'll have to check it out. Thanks!!! Otis Hello Otis. We, Lady Ghost and I, live in Conroe. We call Oakwood Outlaws our "home" club, but also belong to THSS in Columbus, Thunder River Renegades in Magnolia, and Plum Creek in Lockhart. But, we shoot at many other clubs in Texas and Louisiana. Hope you join us shootin' "Classic Cowboy". Ghost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titus A. Gnatsass, SASS #71705 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Does Classic Cowboy eliminate the 92 and the Marlin?If so then you can't shoot a 66-73 in B Western? The answers to these types of questions are easily found in the SASS Handbook. HIGHLY recommended reading for anyone just starting out in this game or for anyone who has to ask these questions. Basic knowledge, really. Scroll to the top of this page, click on the SASS Handbook tab and enjoy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost, SASS #50125 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Does Classic Cowboy eliminate the 92 and the Marlin?If so then you can't shoot a 66-73 in B Western? Hello G.P. Cobb. Sorry, you can not use a '92 or Marlin in "Classic". Those are the rules. But...you can use the '92 and any SASS legal rifle in B-Western. B-Western is a great catagory and a lot of great cowboys and cowgirls shoot it. Ghost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titus A. Gnatsass, SASS #71705 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Hello G.P. Cobb. Sorry, you can not use a '92 or Marlin in "Classic". Those are the rules. But...you can use the '92 and any SASS legal rifle in B-Western. B-Western is a great catagory and a lot of great cowboys and cowgirls shoot it. Ghost I highly recommend folks check the SASS Handbook for answers to these kind of posts/questions. Lots of misinformation is given out by well meaning pards in situations just like this. Someone might go buy the WRONG RIFLE in just this circumstance. Reading the handbook for yourself is the BEST WAY to get the correct information. If you then have questions, bring them to the wire. The more time pards spend reading the handbook, the less confusion about the rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Hello G.P. Cobb. Sorry, you can not use a '92 or Marlin in "Classic". Those are the rules. But...you can use the '92 and any SASS legal rifle in B-Western. B-Western is a great catagory and a lot of great cowboys and cowgirls shoot it. Ghost Hi Ghost, As of this TG Summit (implimented at Winter Range) you may only shoot a rifle or reproduction that was made in 1880 or later in B-Western. Previously, it was 1884 or later. Regards, Allie Mo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost, SASS #50125 Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Hi Ghost, As of this TG Summit (implimented at Winter Range) you may only shoot a rifle or reproduction that was made in 1880 or later in B-Western. Previously, it was 1884 or later. Regards, Allie Mo Allie and Titus, I stand corrected. I'll just stick to what I know, Classic. Ghost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el Gato Gordo - SASS #15162 Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Hola, Otis ~ You are getting some good advice here, and going to Rockvale on the 15th is a good idea. Just check their website before you leave home to make sure that the Colorado Winter hasn't rearranged their plans. They are a great bunch! As Blazen Vaquero said, the Sand Creek Raiders newcomers shoot is a good thing. It may be a bit of a drive to Byers, but i assure you that any event they put on is worth the drive. May I also invite you to attend the Colorado Cowboys match on the first day of any month? Yes, we even shot on January First after checking our brains at the door. You remember the weather that day, I am sure. My contact info is on the website, and I can outfit you to shoot a match if you give me a holler. In fact, if you want to get together between matches, I have a range at my house (about 15 miles east of Fountain) and I can let you try out some guns. See what you like BEFORE you spend money. Buena suerte, amigo, and welcome to the fire! el Gato Gordo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titus A. Gnatsass, SASS #71705 Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Allie and Titus, I stand corrected. I'll just stick to what I know, Classic. Ghost Hey Ghost Hope ya didn't take it that I was singling you out, that wasn't my intent. I was hoping to emphasize the importance of using the SASS Handbook. p.s. I think what you and the other Classic Cowboys got goin is really COOL! T-Bone is definitely the choice for the 1st CC Award. Can't wait to see who shakes out as next years selection. Otis You will indeed find lotsa good info here. Just remember to take some of it with a grain of salt. Keep browsin here and you will do fine. Remember the Handbook. It is your friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otis Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 Hola, Otis ~ You are getting some good advice here, and going to Rockvale on the 15th is a good idea. Just check their website before you leave home to make sure that the Colorado Winter hasn't rearranged their plans. They are a great bunch! As Blazen Vaquero said, the Sand Creek Raiders newcomers shoot is a good thing. It may be a bit of a drive to Byers, but i assure you that any event they put on is worth the drive. May I also invite you to attend the Colorado Cowboys match on the first day of any month? Yes, we even shot on January First after checking our brains at the door. You remember the weather that day, I am sure. My contact info is on the website, and I can outfit you to shoot a match if you give me a holler. In fact, if you want to get together between matches, I have a range at my house (about 15 miles east of Fountain) and I can let you try out some guns. See what you like BEFORE you spend money. Buena suerte, amigo, and welcome to the fire! el Gato Gordo Thanks for the invite. I will holler at ya soon. Otis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Coop SASS 5791 L Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Hey Pard, Based on where you live, take the time to visit the Sand Creek Raiders in Colorado before doing anything else for CAS. Those pards helped me to become a SASS shooter in 1997 with "Bat Masterson" as my mentor. You will get a whole lot of good recommendations from them. It will save you a whole lot of time and trouble getting into our sport. And I am from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. In August 1997 I was in Colorado for a Haz-Mat training program and had a weekend off, saw a post for the Sand Creek Raiders monthly shoot, showed up, and the rest was history. Since then, I am a SASS Territoral Governer for Western PA, and I have two Top Ten Belt Buckles from SASS National Championship Shooting Match (Winter Range) in Arizona. And a whole lot of other CAS shooting awards. Chicken Coop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost, SASS #50125 Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Hey Ghost Hope ya didn't take it that I was singling you out, that wasn't my intent. I was hoping to emphasize the importance of using the SASS Handbook. p.s. I think what you and the other Classic Cowboys got goin is really COOL! T-Bone is definitely the choice for the 1st CC Award. Can't wait to see who shakes out as next years selection. Thanks Titus SASS Handbook Ghost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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