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Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217

TG Voting Process

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Hi Folks,

 

Discussions about the TG voting process and results come up every year. How about participating in an unofficial poll? Maybe we can get it to be a discussion item at the Regionals and above this year.

 

Please keep to the topic and leave the ad hominem (attacking an opponent's character rather than answering his argument) comments out of it. Reply with which of the following you would prefer to have as a method of determining how TGs voted on rule changes.

1. No Change.

2. Publish names of TGs/Proxies who voted and their club name(s).

3. Publish names of TGs who did not vote and their club name(s).

4. Publish names of TGs/Proxies who voted, how they voted and their club name(s).

5. Publish names of all SASS affiliated clubs, who voted for them or "none," and how the person voted on each item or leave blank if no vote was submitted.

6. Publish names of clubs that voted and how they voted. (No names.)

7. Rude comment. Failure to follow instructions. Vote not counted even if gave one.

 

I would like to see number 4 take place as I believe it would remove some of the venom that is directed at the TGs as a group and place the blame where it belongs, with those who did not vote and those who did not vote their clubs' wishes.

 

Thanks,

 

Allie Mo

 

Edit to add number 5.

Edit to add number 6 and word "proxies" after TG if voting.

Edit to add number 7.

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#4, for the same reasons as Miss Allie.

And #3, so the clubs could see who needs to be replaced.

Greeenriver

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#4

 

I'd like to see the voting listed by Club. Really doesn't matter to me who the specific TG is. That person is a representative of the Club. Maybe something like this:

 

Yes

No

Present, Not Voting

Abstain (which would be for the clubs who did not have a TG in attendance nor sent a proxy

 

SD

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I'd go #4, with a note of what proxies they voted.

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I'm OK with either #2 or #4

(either one would include any PROXY voting that took place)

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#3 AND #4. Publish names of all TGs eligible to vote, their club names, and "yea"' "nay" "abstain" or "absent". This is the most informative combo of options and eliminates any wondering if a club member doesn't know the TGs name, for example - and nothing to infer from a TG or Club name that's missing from the report. Proxies should be indicated by some notation - if a club's TG is voting by proxy, that too counts as voting. I mean, if we're going to bother with it, let's be thorough!

 

And one more thing - THANK YOU ALLIE MO for trying to help something constructive to arise from the moaning and bellyaching about this year's voting! YOU ARE THE BEST!!!! I don't know what we'd do without ya, but here's hoping we'll never have to find out!

 

Hi-Yo and Awaaaaaaaay,

That Masked Man

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I'd go #4, with a note of what proxies they voted.

The proxies would be listed under the varying club(s) names in number 4.

 

Dan, I thought that club members would want to know who had their proxies, whether it was sent with an individual or Hipshot (who votes the emails that do not assign the proxy to another person).

 

Triple E, I'm not sure that a list of what clubs did not vote would be needed. If your club isn't listed, you'd have that answer.

 

Masked, that would be okay with me, however it would take a bit of space ($$$) if it were in the Chronicle.

 

I will edit to add No. 5.

 

Regards,

 

Allie Mo

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#4

 

This will protect those of us who try to do it right...

 

FYI to do it right this year I published the agenda on our web site and provided for a vote by email for those who wanted too and got 4 total votes, had a public discussion Q&A and vote on the items at our November shoot, posted the vote results on the web page, registered my proxy with SASS as required, sent my proxy to a trusted TG that was attending the convention that I know voted the way that my club asked.

 

This is not a small amount of work folks...

 

It is very sad though to see so many people not happy with their TG representation.

 

-Deadlee

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Number 4 sounds good to me

 

Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee

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Hey Folks,

 

This is really :rolleyes: that TGs are posting that they want publication of how they voted. It is a start of a rebuttal to those who doubt our integrity. Keep 'em coming!

 

Thanks,

 

Allie Mo

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It is very sad though to see so many people not happy with their TG representation.

 

Funny thing about this whole flap is, I haven't seen where anyone has said they're not happy with their TG!

 

I'm certainly happy with mine. Someone was upset about the outcome of the voting and wanted to know who voted how. I'm not even sure that's a good idea because it may open TGs up to harassment over how they vote, club wishes one way or another notwithstanding. If we are going to make the voting 'open' by publishing the votes - which again, I'm not sure is a good idea - we should do so in a way that gives a complete picture of how the voting went, absentees and abstentions included.

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why dont shooters

 

just ask their TG, how they voted and why

 

what am I missing? :rolleyes:

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So where is the option for a club that had another officer represent the club since the TG could not attend? Looks kinda like a survey about your congressman. Congress stinks but not mine. Grow up folks!

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Miss Allie, would you get upset if I offered another option? (I hope not 'cause I'm gonna do it anyway.

 

#5 List the names of all the clubs that cast votes and how they voted.

 

This option doesn't list any individual person's name. I don't like seeing people's names in things like this, i just too ripe for abuse. If the TG didn't cast the same vote that his club wanted him to,that's between the club and the TG. It's nobody else's business. They can handle it howver works best for them.

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#4, but don't have a problem with our TG....

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Miss Allie, would you get upset if I offered another option? (I hope not 'cause I'm gonna do it anyway.

 

#5 List the names of all the clubs that cast votes and how they voted.

 

This option doesn't list any individual person's name. I don't like seeing people's names in things like this, i just too ripe for abuse. If the TG didn't cast the same vote that his club wanted him to,that's between the club and the TG. It's nobody else's business. They can handle it howver works best for them.

 

+1

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Miss Allie, would you get upset if I offered another option? (I hope not 'cause I'm gonna do it anyway.

 

#5 List the names of all the clubs that cast votes and how they voted.

 

This option doesn't list any individual person's name. I don't like seeing people's names in things like this, i just too ripe for abuse. If the TG didn't cast the same vote that his club wanted him to,that's between the club and the TG. It's nobody else's business. They can handle it howver works best for them.

 

Philly,

 

That was my point, too. I believe this latest "controversy" over the TG Summit is really about the voting results and not how individual TGs voted. A 2/3 majority vote is fairly difficult to obtain. On the national level, think about how many Presidential vetoes get overturned by the US Congress--not all that many.

 

SD

 

P.S. Allie: I like this thread. Thank you.

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#4 Works just fine for me. I carried FOUR proxies and each club T/G giving me their proxy ALSO gave me a sheet showing how their CLUB wanted me to vote. I did just that. If there had been any major changes to the wording or intent of any of the issues, I would have called the other club T/Gs and consulted with them about their club's desires. As it was, that was not necessary this year. Sweetwater Jack

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Miss Allie, would you get upset if I offered another option? (I hope not 'cause I'm gonna do it anyway.

 

#5 List the names of all the clubs that cast votes and how they voted.

 

This option doesn't list any individual person's name. I don't like seeing people's names in things like this, i just too ripe for abuse. If the TG didn't cast the same vote that his club wanted him to,that's between the club and the TG. It's nobody else's business. They can handle it howver works best for them.

Hi Pard,

 

Will do! I added a No. 5, so this will be No. 6

 

Also, look for another edit after the TG.

 

Regards,

 

Allie Mo

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I would say no change needed.

 

While I have not traveled far and wide to many many clubs, I have gotten around a little and I shoot monthly matches mainly at one gun club. I have not heard any complaining about how votes were cast, nor do I hear complaints about TGs, even at clubs I visit.

 

The only complaining I know of is pretty much here on the wire. I can only conclude that exposing how the TG's voted is a waste of time and will not lead to less complaining. Afterall, it IS the wire.

 

So FWIW, that was my 2 cents.

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I'm OK with either #2 or #4

(either one would include any PROXY voting that took place)

Hi Capt.,

 

Please pick one. One vote per person. I'm making a spreadsheet (sometimes I miss work :rolleyes:;) )

 

Regards,

 

Allie Mo

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I like My TG (don't tell him that) and I talk to him .....

 

But I'm fine with #4 ...

 

 

 

Jabez Cowboy

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Dan and Philly, I'll put you down for number 6.

 

Virgil, I can happily agree with you on most things you posted.

 

I'm only keeping track of names so that I know who voted and who changed their mind. If I take this any farther, no names will be used. So, send me a PM or email if you wish anonomity on this thread but would like to be counted.

 

Thanks!

 

Allie

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Dan and Philly, I'll put you down for number 6.

 

Virgil, I can happily agree with you on most things you posted.

 

I'm only keeping track of names so that I know who voted and who changed their mind. If I take this any farther, no names will be used. So, send me a PM or email if you wish anonomity on this thread but would like to be counted.

 

Thanks!

 

Allie

 

 

You are correct again, 6 it is.

 

SD

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I vote for option #1.

 

I like all the TG's of the clubs I belong to. I have no reason to believe they voted any other way that what the majority of the club members told him how they wanted it.

 

I don't know or care how Club BR-549 voted way-over/far-away voted.

 

Blastmaster

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I'm fine with #4, as contrasted with Old #4. :rolleyes:

 

I have no problem with anyone/everyone knowing how I voted on behalf of my club. And I have full faith in Sweetwater Jack who took my proxy; I'm sure he voted either as directed or as necessary for the best interest of our club if changes or clarifications surfaced.

 

I really don't understand all the dissatisfaction with the TG's. All the ones I know vote their clubs' decisions and have the best interests of the game at heart. But I'm in full support of tossing out any who don't fulfill the obligations of the job, the most important of which surrounds the TG Agenda items and the resulting voting process.

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:rolleyes:;):wub:;):angry:

Allie:

 

Reckon I'm for #4 too.

 

But my favorite drink is Ol' #7.

 

Mustang Gregg

[TGing for 2 NE clubs]

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Guess I'll have to change my vote to #6 now that we have a couple of new options. Thanks again Allie for sewing us up a silk purse from that...uh...thing we had before.

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Dan and Philly, I'll put you down for number 6.

 

Virgil, I can happily agree with you on most things you posted.

 

I'm only keeping track of names so that I know who voted and who changed their mind. If I take this any farther, no names will be used. So, send me a PM or email if you wish anonomity on this thread but would like to be counted.

 

Thanks!

 

Allie

 

 

No no, don't do that. I was just offering it as an option. I'm sending my actual vote in via proxy. Madd Mike will be brining it. :rolleyes:

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