H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619
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Posts posted by H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619
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On 6/20/2026 at 10:28 PM, John Kloehr said:
New York style pizza is available in New York at L'Industrie Pizzeria in Williamsburg/West Village, John's of Bleecker Street, and Joe's Pizza, and others (so I hear).
But New York Style? Available nationally including in New York from Domino's, Pizza Hut, Papa John’s, and Sbarro among others. Not sure New Yorkers will agree,
In New England, we call "New York" style pizza, "Italian Pizza."
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20 hours ago, Dapper Dave said:
All I can add is I did think it would be a hoot to show up to a match in Imperial Russian uniform with matched Nagants...but what rifle and shotgun...
I always wanted a Webley, but I will be the odd man out - I want one in 38/200 since I started loading that one for my Victory Model and bought the NOE 204gr mold. Pain in the behind to use, but when it drops good bullets, they are GOOD...Also did some gelatin testing in that caliber. But that's another story.
So for you Webley guys, what's the best one to look for in 38/200?
Hmmm....
If in uniform, with these...
... I'd probably use this...
It's a .44-40, so that's "closest" to .44 Rimfire. They were both Russian Army issue, just not at the same time. But it's the most "logical" thing I can think of.
For a shotgun? That's a little more hard to say. I am sure someone in Russia made a SxS, but I have no idea. So, I'll just say, generically, a European made shotgun to be as flexible as possible.
Now, what do I have in my collection that fits the bill?
Well, at the moment, for a European single barrel I could use...
... this Webley. (See, I got it back to Webley!) Interesting gun to be sure. The hammer is kinda hard to cock. So, maybe I'd go with a European double, like this...
....Darne 16 gauge.
Interesting when opened.
Now, the only Webley ever made in .38/200 was the Mark IV.
That would be the Upper Left pistol, and it was the first ever Webley I got. Sweet shooter. I have never bothered to try and match the .38/200 performance with my handloads. I just run regular .38 S&W in it. But, if I can ever obtain some reloadable brass with the proper headstamp, I will do give it a try. I did recently find some vintage ammo, but it was berdan primed, so I didn't buy it.
Now, the S&W Victory Model that is usually stamped .38 S&W, can handle .38/200 no problem. As to if a Webley or a S&W is a better gun, well, they are both good and you can't go wrong with either of them.
I don't have an Enfield revolver in the caliber. They are very similar to the Webley, but beyond that, I don't know too much about them.
BTW, .38/200 is something of a misnomer. Now, one of my S&W Victory models is indeed marked .38/200 on the barrel, but not from the factory. That was a marking added by the Brits after they took possession of the pistol. The factory caliber making is .38 S&W. It is possible to get commerically loaded ammo in .38/200, but as it all done by specialty loaders, it's headstamped .38 S&W.
Now, as to the NAME of the cartridge, the original version was .38/200 Cartridge, Revolver Mk I and it used a lead round nose bullet of 200 grains in weight. But... Military ammo has to be full metal jacket, so it was changed, to a 180 grain FMJ called either Cartridge, Pistol, .380 Mk II or .380 Mk IIz. My Australian S&W Victory model did come with a few rounds of ammo, and it is headstamped .380 Z.
And that's all the information I can share at the moment.
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6 minutes ago, Tuolumne Lawman 6127 said:
NICE!
Thanks.
I always wanted one with the adjustable rear elevator sight cuz it looks really nifty, but I did not let that stop me when I found this one.
Browning has no records of these Canadian made ones, so no way to letter it. I did try to figure out whatever happened to the Inglis company, and it still exists under a different name I can't remember right now, but when I contacted them to ask if they have any records, they did not respond.
Of course, neither did GM when I asked them about their Inland branded M1 Carbines. -
7 hours ago, Tuolumne Lawman 6127 said:
An Inglis with original stock is on my short list.
They are nifty.
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2 hours ago, Giuseppe Calderoni said:
This is what they said:
At least you got an answer.
When I wrote and asked them if they were gonna a traditionally configured one in .44 Magnum instead of just the modernized version, I got no response beyond the, "Thank you for writing, we'll get back to you," one.
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Silly me...
This is my BSA...
I recently saw some listings for a nice SxS, a Jungle Carbine, a Mark III SMLE, and some kind of a bolt action that were made by them as well.
Oh well.-
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Well, as you may remember from some other posts/threads, I have been trying to get "factory letters" for everything in the collection that I can.
We all know that many US gun makers do offer historical documentation, but I have not been able to find many European ones that do. There are a couple, but not a lot. The Paul Mauser Archive has records for Mauser made Pistols and the Webley Scott Archive can get you a letter for Webley pistols, but not shotguns, for example.
So, today, on a whim, I Googled "BSA Firearms factory letter," and I found a reference for a John Knibbs International that said they have BSA's old records, and they do offer historical research documentation. So, I Googled John Knibbs International, and found this link https://www.airgunspares.com
At first, I didn't think it was all that promising, but on the FAQ page, I found this...
Q) How do I know how old my BSA gun is?
A) We hold most of the original handwritten serial number ledgers for sporting rifles that BSA kept during their production period up to the late seventies. We can offer a dating service (no, not that sort!) of your BSA gun if required. This process is quite time consuming as we have to trawl through numerous ledgers to locate the exact serial number of the weapon so a fee is payable for the service. Please contact us if you would like to know the exact day (sometimes as precise as morning or afternoon) that a gun left the BSA factory.
Well, that sounds promising! I have written to ask them if they can look up my BSA made Martini. If/when I find out what they charge, I'll let you all know. -
1 hour ago, Sedalia Dave said:
Easier and most likely cheaper to just reline the barrel with the caliber you want.
Okay, that is the question that I was wondering about. Would it be easier, and less expensive, to swap barrels, or line the existing one.
I had guessed the swapping would be simpler, but then again, would a 92 barrel fit on a 73, or need major modifications. But relining might work out to be a simpler modification.
It's an interesting bit of wonderment. -
Let's say you want a .25-20 rifle, but you don't want a Winchester 92 or a Marlin 94. You want a Winchester 73 or a Colt Lightning.
Now, correct me if I am wrong.
The easiest way to do it is get a "donor" gun in .32-20. Most likely a modern Italian replica, and not an original. Since the .25-20 is just the .32-20 necked down to .25 caliber, all you need do is swap out the barrel. (Assuming that you can find one that fits.)
For some reason, while this seems like it's all you'd have to do, something inside me tells me there'd be more too it than that.
Of course, if the replica makers would just market the rifles in the caliber, that'd be even easier, but I don't see that ever happening.
At the moment, this is purely an academic thought experiment. -
Here's a related question that just occurred to me.
Taking a revolver and somehow converting it to a cartridge that they have never been chambered for by the people who made/make it.
An example is my Colt above in .22 Hornet.
But it would not have to be limited to "unusual" calibers. S&W and Uberti have never made any of the Model 3 revolvers in .32-20. Converting one would be an expensive, but interesting proposition. I have seen picture of a Merwin & Hulbert in .25-20 and have heard of others trying it. So anyway, let's add this possibility to the discussion, and see if anyone has anything to add.
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1 hour ago, Three Foot Johnson said:
The cartridge was a .357 mag case (?) necked down to .25 caliber. Ruger made a single shot pistol for it, the Hawkeye, that resembled a Blackhawk, and Thompson Center also made a barrel for it. I'm pretty sure I've got a TC barrel. I think Marlin may have made a lever action for it too.
Thanks, Three Foot.
I looked it up. Interesting stuff. Thanks for the details. By a strict reading of the rules, it would not be main match legal, even in a rifle, but looks like a fun round. I'd assume you'd have to work up a handload for it to keep the velocity down, a necked down .357 with a light bullet like that would be pretty speedy. Still, if I can download .22 Hornet to "SASS Velocities" just for the fun of doing it, I'd guess this one could be done as well.
And, in a theoretical single shot side match that allows "anything from .22 Short to .50-70" then the Ruger and the round would be "okay."
I like learning about unusual stuff like this. I doubt I'd search one out today, but if I knew of it when it came out, I might have considered grabbing one and a buncha ammo. -
I suddenly understand the problem!
I don't actually think there is anything wrong with your gun mechanically. Maybe just that the magazine spring, as alluded to by a previous post, could stand to lose a coil or two.
I had something very similar happen to me with one of my AWA Lightnings. Getting rounds 9 and especially 10 was very difficult, and had a problem similar to yours.
I discovered there was a spacer in the mag tube to limit capacity. Once to took that out, the problem went away. You obviously don't have a spacer, but a too long spring might be the culprit. -
3 hours ago, Cusz M. Dutch SASS Life 55326 said:
Hey what about a 256 Mag? Although a single shot it appears to be a six shooter. Please don't flame me. Just stirring the pot ...
Since I don't know what that is, how about a pic?
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I applaud the advice and work done to fix the issue. Bravo to all around.
But to be honest, as I read it all over and try to make sense of it, and fail to do so, I interpret all of it the same way...
Take it to a gunsmith.
But then again, I am not good at fixing things by hand myself. -
The problem with the 49 Colt is that there is no way to lock the cylinder between chambers. The above 49 is a .38 Long Colt factory conversion. The handbook does say 5 shot revolver can be loaded with 4 and thus the fifth shot loaded on the clock.
As to the "is it a pocket pistol" question, this is something that I feel the rules are ambiguous. The handbook does say that a pocket pistol can't be a converted to a main match pistol. It also says that a pocket pistol has a barrel length of 4" or less. But, no where is a minimum length listed for a main match revolver. Now, obviously we are talking single action pockets here, not the DA pockets most people use. What does "converted" mean? Based on the context and the wording, it seems that you could make the interpretation that "converting" a pocket pistol to main match would refer to one of those alluded to, but never seen, main match stages where a pocket pistol is introduced as an extra gun. If I had used the above 49 in a stage like that, (or the Merwin or the New House) then I could not use them as main match revolvers for the rest of the match. But if I used them from the get go as main match revolvers, no conversion is made.
The Model 1-1/2 above is an excellent illustration of this ambiguity. It's got a 6" barrel. No way it's ever a pocket pistol. But one with a 3" barrel would be. Does that mean the long one is main match legal, but the short one is not? (Well, I mentioned why it's not in general, but I think you see the point.)
Or for that matter, the Remington 63. That's a 5 shot .32 that is described as legal in the handbook. (Generically) But there is no way to argue that it is not legal for pocket side matches. Does that make it not legal for main match use? -
2 hours ago, Trailrider #896 said:
The main problem with the '87 is NOT the gun itself, but the silly SAS rules that only allow loading two shells.
Same with the 97. This is a rule that should be revisited.
And don't use the excuse that it's okay if the stage description allows it. Over the years, I have seen this twice. No one writes stages that way. -
3 hours ago, Widder, SASS #59054 said:
Then ironically, a friend handed me a 97 at his house one day and said.....'try this'.
I immediately started a love relationship with the 97 and its been good for me.
Before I actually got into the game and was learning about it, I read how the 97 was legal. That intrigued me because this really strangle looking old timey pump shotgun was just more visually INTERESTING to me than a double was. (Even though I had my Dad's Parker.)
Anyway, one day, I saw a really nice 97 with a 20" barrel. The stock was stamped WPD, which I "interpret" to stand for Winchester Police Department. This was my first primary main match shotgun, and it served me well. I did eventually get a Cody letter for it, but it's one of their minimal ones that tells you the date it was made and nothing else. (A lot of my Cody letters are that way...) 1930, if you want to know.
Anywho, while enjoying this gun, I decided that I wanted to find and obtain a long barreled 97, just to have one. I eventually did find a 30" full choked one. It's more worn with age, dating to 1909, and again, no other info in the letter. This gun very much feels its age, but is still a good shooter. I had to replace the, (I don't know what it's properly called) think that threads the barrel into the frame that can be adjusted to make the fit tighter. Even at its tightest, it was loose. But with the thing replaced its tight like it should be. But here's the fun part, when I took it to a match the first time to use it, I figured, since everyone "knows" that short barreled shotguns are better suited to our game, that I'd not enjoy using this one. I figured it would be used for Cowboy trap on occasion, but that would be it. Well... That's not what happened. I absolutely loved the long barrel. For one thing, I never missed with it, and the targets always went down every time. Something I could not assert with the shorter barrel version. So, this gun became my new primary main match shotgun.
The next 97 I got was a Norinco replica of the WWI trench gun. Fun thing to stick a bayonet on for a Wild Bunch match. (I've done it!) When the came out, I had mentioned how cool they were to my Dad, and the next thing I knew, he bought me one as a gift.
Up next, I figured that since I'd never own a real Winchester 93, I'd find an obtain a 93/97 to approximate one to have in the collection. Very well made gun. Sadly, not SASS legal, but I still like having it.
But not too long after that, I found an honest to goodness real Winchester 93! This one letters to 1895, the letter does note the 30" barrel, and while the finish is faded, mechanically, it is in superb condition. I don't think it's been fired all that much. I have loaded up some black powder shells for it, and it shoots quite nicely. Oh, and the ONLY way I could get a shell to sorta fall out of the ejection port (using spent shells) so that the extractor could theoretically hit the primer on closing, was to tilt the gun more than 45 degrees to the right when cycling the action. Something I do not do in real life. Again, not SASS legal, but a nice thing to have in the collection.
Then, came my most recent 97. A very nice Black Diamond Trap model. The letter tells me it was made in 1914, and nothing else. But this one is in near perfect condition as far as the action is concerned. Again, I don't think it's been fired all that much. But, it is now, at least officially, my primary main match shotgun. This one gets a lot of commentary once people realize what it is.
Those are my specific 97 stories.
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How do we want to define "Big Bore?" I assume, at the very least, something that can not fit in a standard size main match revolver. But... do we include something like the .30-30, or do we put in a .40+ qualifier?
Personally, I would say go with the anything that won't fit in a standard revolver definition.
That being said, depending on the context of what it is gonna be used for, that will dictate your caliber choice. A .30-30 is great, but it doesn't have the extra long range potential of a .45-70.
But at the "shorter" long ranges that many SASS type events use, .30-30 is more than adequate.
So with that said, there are many options that the shooter can choose from and enjoy.
And since the title of the post is Big Bore Levers, I won't include my .45-70 Rolling Block. (Oops! I just did!)Sears Ted Williams Model 100; .30-30. Better known as a post-83 Winchester 94
J.C. Higgins Model 45; .30-30. Better known as a Sears branded pre-safety Marlin 336C.
Winchester 1894 .32 Winchester Special Pre-64.
Martini Henry AC II Artillery Carbine .303 British. (Hey it IS a lever gun!)
Winchester 1895 .30-40 Krag.
Note: The .303 and the .30-40 will give you much longer range performance than the .30-30 will.
Winchester 1886 .45-70
Chiappa 1886 .45-70. (Yes, I Mares Legged it. But it's still a Big Bore Lever Gun)
Colt Large Frame Lightning .45-85
Depending on what I want to do, and how I want to do it, all of these guns have served me well over the years.
I'll try to add pics when I get home from work. -
I don't think it's the NRA that is the problem, I think it's Wayne. And that's rather sad because for years he was the face of the organization, even more than whoever was the President at the time. And for a very long time, he did a good job. But now, it seems like whatever good he had done has been erased by all of this stuff.
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And now I'll point out that, for me, this is rather ironic as when I started this game, I thought the shotgun would be the part that appealed to me the least. Not saying it's appeals the most now, but only that appreciate its part in the game in a way I had not realized I would all those years ago.
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My .45-70 journey was as follows. First gun was an 1888 Trapdoor rifle. Worked up a "Trapdoor safe" load of, I think it was, 4195, and found it to be a pleasant shooter. Second and third guns were an 1873 Trapdoor carbine and an 1886 Winchester with a 20 inch barrel. Suddenly that trapdoor safe load kicked painfully hard. Switched to Trailboss and the kick vanished. Never looked back. Have more rifles in the caliber and two pistols. It's a great one.
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I tried 10 grains of Red Dot with about 1 ounce of shot.
These were mouse fart loads that don't knock down targets.
Upped to 12. Still no recoil, but now knocks things down. -
Traditionally, I've been a 97 guy. For various reasons, I have been shooting my 87, single and double barrel shotguns a lot more of late. (Doubles and singles each get get 2 categories, with and without external hammers.) In doing so, I have come to realize that each type of shotgun has its own unique level of "fun to shoot" going for it. I am not saying here that any one type is better than another, although for most us, that is probably true. Some folks can run an 87 fast, and others will struggle with it. But I have found that no matter how good or bad I am with each type, I enjoy all of them. Each gives a different experience, and can be rewarding in different ways if you get really good with them. Heck, having come close, I am sure that with practice I could reload a single in time to shoot the popper before it hits the ground. As it was, I got it just afterwards the one time I tried, so who knows? I was surprised how much fun that $50 Hopkins and Allen was overall, and I will use it again. Stepping up to the line with my Dad's 19" Parker makes me feel good, even if the pattern is so wide it doesn't hit hard enough to knock over the targets most of the time. Granted, I am still trying to get rid of some underloaded mouse farts, but there is a way to compensate. I just give it both barrels! Won't do that with proper loads though... The 30" F/F Parker knocks stuff down better with its tighter pattern. I've got a hammered LC Smith I am eager to try for the challenge, and taking the Darne out turns heads every time. The exceedingly rare stage where you are allowed to stoke an 87 or a 97 is always smile inducing when you get to cut loose as fast as you can, and the 87 itself has unique challenges, that once you master them, you get a sense of accomplishment very different from the others.
Variety, they say, is the spice of life. And to my pleasant surprise, I have found that the shotgun can offer a lot of interesting flavors.-
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Big bore levers
in SASS Wire
Posted
Gonna start a separate thread on Big Bore Revolvers.