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Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

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Posts posted by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

  1. I load a 175 grain cast slug for revolvers, with 4.2 grains Winchester Super Target.  Makes about 650 FPS.  Clean.    180 grain bullet would be same powder charge, almost same velocity.

    good luck, GJ

    • Thanks 1
  2. None of the Uberti toggle rifle short stroke kits are just drop in.  There's enough variation in the Uberti guns to make each one a little different, and require hand fitting.


    It's not a job for a first-time hobbyist.   In your situation (other than being remote from lots of smiths) - I'd advise using a good cowboy gunsmith.  "Regular" gunsmiths often don't know enough about the guns and the game to get the gun tuned right after installing the kit.


    And in your case, with the very-low production numbers of .44 magnum 73s, it's hard to tell if ANY short stroke kit will even fit and last.  We've heard rumors the links and lever are either beefed up or higher grade steel in the .44 mag versions.  They weren't made until a few years ago, and have already been discontinued, AFAIK. 


    Your gun and your personal level of expertise, as you have described, don't lend themselves to a high probability of a satisfactory outcome.   I'd look through the cowboy gunsmith list in the sticky section and  then give a few a call.   If I just had to name one for you right now, it would be Jim Bowie at Cowboys and Indian shop (Arizona).  His MANY years of experience with designing and installing short strokes in toggle guns will be quite valuable to your decision.


    good luck, GJ

    • Like 2
  3. The screws which are involved in disassembly for cleaning a toggle link gun are real nice to have in the hard versions.  They get taken out and reinstalled so often, that factory-soft screws stay pristine only with a TON of extra care during routine maintenance.   


    These would be:

    side plate screw

    lever screw

    lever and lifter spring screws

    trigger guard screws (2)

    tang screw

    butt plate screw (1, same screw used to attach lower tang to the stock as they attach butt plate to the stock)


    Most others are much less frequently removed.


    good luck, GJ




    • Like 1
  4. 5 hours ago, Billy D Texan said:

    I was using the proper bit from my kit and it bent thus causing the issue.  

    And thus the need for a 1/4" bit hand impact driver.  The Uberti factory installs fairly soft screws and uses high torques.  That works well until the first disassembly has to be done.  VTI carries complete sets of hardened screws.  First thing I do when I get a new Italian made firearm and a new screw kit is disassemble completely, clean well, remove rust from mag tube (if it has one), deburr any rough spots, and THEN start to do any tuning work that I want to do.   Then it's reassembled with proper lubrication and hard screws to moderate torques.


    Don't force a bit or screwdriver past it's limit of strength.  Ruins both driver and screw head.  It takes a few "lessons" like that to learn where the limits are.  You can see the deformation of the screw slot just barely starting - that's when you stop and go to impact drivers or even more severe techniques to get the screws loose.  The loosening of a tight screw needs as much force placed co-axial to the screw as you put on twisting the screw, to keep the tip fully engaged in the slot.  So chuck the gun in a well padded, solid vise and put your upper body weight directly above the screw so you can push AND twist.


    good luck, GJ

  5. First off, here's a nice video by Maker-Wright that explains how the action should be working, and how the slide lock specifically should work.  Good stuff!



    Cocking the hammer normally causes the action slide lock to lock the action from moving, so if he is having to do this to ALLOW the action to run, that slide lock bar is probably bent or in very bad shape.   Bending the action slide lock bar can be caused by pulling back hard on the slide while shooting.   As the video explains, this puts a lot of force directly on the end of the action slide lock bar. 


    Sometimes burrs on the rear end of the action slide bar or where it fits into the action slide lock can cause the lock not to open.

    A bent or worn slide lock bar (or worn side of hammer) can be causing it to lock when not wanted.

    Dirty carrier slot in which the slide lock. pivots 

    Too tight a tension on the recoil spring (helical spring around the mag tube), which jams the action slide bar into the action slide lock bar..  


    A well known gunsmith working specifically on the 97 is Squibber and crew  at  Old Western Gun Repair.



    good luck, GJ

    • Thanks 1
  6. You really need some gunsmith size flat bits.   If you can afford 'em, get the Brownells regular set and the thin-bit set.  You will buy once and use them for a LONG time.  Otherwise, we have some lists of specific Brownells magna-tip bits for particular western guns.


    Here's one from Pale Wolf Brunelle some time ago:


    Ruger Single Action
    150-4 *
    180-3 *
    210-4 *

    Rossi 92
    150-4 *
    180-3 *
    210-4 *

    * Duplicated in above two sets

    Colt/clone SAA



    340-6 butt Plate

    Marlin 1894




    Marlin 336




    Wait till you take out the lever and lifter springs, or the mag tube cap. 

    No, on second thought, don't wait.  They just get harder to remove the longer they stay in the gun and get rained on.  Get into that mag tube and clean out any rust, grease, dirt.  Then use a dry waxy oil to protect all that rust-prone area.  Eezox or Boeshield T9 work there.


    good luck, GJ


    • Like 3
  7. For a 366 Hornady/Pacific press?  See Hornady parts dept - give 'em a call! 


    May not be in stock, though, seeing how many folks have dusted off their shotshell presses recently.  But up until a year ago, they have always had the parts I needed.


    good luck, GJ



  8. English shooters report they have no problems getting enough shotshells to shoot sporting clays across the pond.   They are kinda wondering what we're complaining about.


    good luck, GJ

    • Like 1
  9. Both the .357 and .45 Colt levers should be interchangeable in factory guns having no mods, and both having the same style of stock (either both straight, or both pistol grip, sporting).   The SAME part number (VTI part UB:240089) is used for any caliber of a straight-stock Uberti rifle.


    Your .357 lever appears to have been heavily modified post-factory, if that was originally a Uberti lever.


    I assume you are asking about the different positions of the the surface of the lifter arm contact on the lever boss?    The .357 lever has had a LOT of metal taken off (to make a short stroke kit work, probably).  The metal for fitting the lifter arm is usually taken off the lifter arm pad, NOT off the lever boss, to make a SS kit fit.   So, the .357 lever is NOT a good model to use if you are trying to fit the new .45 Colt gun back together.


    The bottom (.45 Colt) lever looks like what the factory produces, before any fitting.  Since the arm contact still has a well-rounded fillet at the end of the lifter arm flat.


    I also see the .357 lever has a flattened "spur" at the rear of trigger guard, too - probably to prevent the owner pinching his trigger finger when the lever closed (because he was not careful with his trigger finger position).


    So, I'd want to use the bottom,  .45 Colt, lever geometry, and fit the short stroke parts to the lever, not the lever to the SS kit parts.  You will get a better fit up doing that, and in future any replacement parts will fit as Uberti designed them to.


    good luck, GJ





  10. 6 hours ago, John Kloehr said:

    Hydrogen peroxide is just water with extra oxygen.

    Sure, and you stayed awake in HS chemistry classes, too.   It's chemically reactive oxygen cations in H2O2 that make it DIFFERENT from water.  Your claim would make  sodium chlorite (a strong oxidizer and very toxic) the same as table salt, with a little extra oxygen.


    Please don't spread such mis-info about hazardous chemicals. 


    Hydrogen peroxide is a strong oxidizer, even dilute.  That is why it bubbles out and sterilizes wounds.  It would certainly be necessary to prepare peroxide bottles by washing and rinsing and drying before use.     But, as several of us mentioned earlier (including yourself), it is usually easy to find other loaders who have retained a few old powder jugs that are so much better for storing powder.  And it sounds like OP has had several such offers.  He should go for it!


    good luck, GJ



    • Thanks 1
  11. On 7/21/2021 at 5:33 PM, bgavin said:

    The old ammo cans were made out of metal.. so I figured coffee cans might be a good substitute.


    Army and Navy Powder storage "cans" that I have handled when working in a DOD funded explosives research facility were heavy gauge galvanized steel and had a very tight rubber gasketed lid to prevent leakages both into and out of the container.


    The plastic lids that go on coffee cans won't last even a few months when I store polished brass in them.



    7 hours ago, bgavin said:

    My comment is the SAAMI document is the lawyer response.


    SAAMI is the sporting firearms industry standards committee.  As such, it provides the collective recommendations from the companies which manufacture all the smokeless powder commonly used.   They provide these safety standards for transport and storage so that we don't have to hire organic chemists who can certify for your local fire department or legislative body how to safely store powder.


    Yes, you can usually "get away" with not following the standards for safely storing hazardous materials at the consumer level.  Most of the time.  But safety standards are put in place to take care of all expected (and unusual) situations the consumer might encounter.  Car accidents?   Major house fire?  Earthquake?  Floods?  Aircraft impact? Etc.  Are all those covered well enough with your storage plan that does not follow industry recommendations to defend a lawsuit based on your end-user storage of a hazardous material in today's court/legal environments if something does go wrong, whether the causative situation was your fault or not?    Doing something cheap but out of standards can quickly sign you up for big risk.


    SAAMI was put in place by shooter community demands for better standards in the shooting industry in the 1920s.  I support SAAMI recommendations and standards because I don't want to see either a return to the chaos of the industry that existed shortly after the introduction of cartridge firearms and smokeless powder, nor unreasonable safety regulations promulgated by legislative bodies that pay no attention to practical and cost-effective guidelines which let us use firearms safely and with reasonable costs and inconveniences.   We've seen too much of those reactions from government already.    Just my personal opinion.


    good luck, GJ



    • Thanks 1
  12. If this is REALLY about getting an inner, factory marked box,  I would not dream of asking Uberti or a major distributor to supply an inner box that has Uberti markings.   First, it implies to a potential gun buyer that the original factory box has been preserved in perfect condition. And hoping to add value on a firearm sale by having what might look like an "original box."  By supplying a replacement box that was not original to the firearm.  Second, I strongly doubt Uberti ships extra empty gun boxes to distributors anyway.


    Maybe it would be possible to get such a box from a distributor if they have a few laying around, either unmarked or with another gun's serial number.  Would not be authentic to the original gun.  Without the matching serial number and model information that is placed on the box at the factory, any serious collector would see through the ruse of having a non-matching box.  It may not affect a firearm resale value to have a replacement factory part, but a replacement "factory" box - hmmmpf.


    Why would someone bother?  


    good luck, GJ

  13. Well, if you can repurpose a box, do it.  If you can't, new commercial boxes will work for someone who needs a few rather than a few thousand (made to order).   Anyone can look at the prices and see if this works for them.


    They are much more secure than shipping in a ragged thin 3-times used box held together with a roll of tape.   Which I have received several times, and often with at least some damage.


    good luck, GJ

  14. If you can't find them locally, ULine will ship you suitable double-wall brown shipping boxes of just about any size.   End up being about $4 apiece.   That's where I get mine when I run out of extras.


    Uline - here's one size of box that I have ordered, but they have a HUGE catalog....





    These come in minimum quantity of 15.   But they are great.


    good luck, GJ

    • Like 1
  15. I'd hunt down any commercial loaders in your area.  Bug them for their empty powder containers of any size. 


    The plastic of powder containers is specially designed NOT to interact with residual ethers, esters, -(acet)ones, and alcohol type solvents used in manufacturing powder.


    For example, leaving Winchester Super Handicap powder in contact with the rigid plastic RCBS uses in powder measures results in the powder dissolving into the container walls and changing composition to be who-knows-what.  You take a pretty big risk of ruining the powder using just any plastic jar or baggie.   Soft plastic bags would be the LAST thing I would use due to the plasticizers that keep them flexible.  Most things put into plastic containers are pretty inert chemically.   Smokeless powder does not show up in dictionary under "chemically inert."


    If you are neighbors and have a good working relationship, just take over a 1# powder jar and fill it as you need it.    Each one takes ownership of half of the caddy (8#) bottles.  Mark on the outside of the caddy when the neighbor takes a small jar out.   At least you will never contaminate the caddy.  And you split the fire hazards.  And if you use 6 pounds of Unique and he uses 7 pounds of Blue Dot, you don't have to go on trips to borrow-back to match the uneven powder consumption patterns.


    good luck, GJ

    • Like 4
  16. Quote

    Do you have someone you would recommend for the stock?  


    A frequent poster here and stockmaker - Ace of Hearts.  No, with a great deal of sorrow - too late to seek his assistance.


    Couple of fantastic gun restoration companies - Turnbull or Run-n-Iron.


    But local stock wood craftsmen probably will be cheaper and faster.   Your local guy might be someone at Alhman's in Morristown, MN, like Bob Kolling.


    Ask around your local matches - good stock makers/fixers sometimes do little advertising.


    good luck, GJ

  17. If you keep that 12 gauge for your son to use, get the stock repaired to pull that crack together and get a professional-quality bedding job done to get a 100% fit between wood and steel at the scallops and tangs.  Glass bedding is cheaper and if done professionally, probably just as strong as wood to metal, or more so.  The most common problem that SKBs have is splitting buttstocks - sometimes due to loose mounting bolt, sometimes due to sloppy fitting between wood and steel.


    Modding it to be a great cowboy gun will raise the value to action shooters, and lower the value to other shooters.   I try to separate the concepts of usefulness for cowboy shooting and the "resale value" of the gun, so I don't try to solve for two "variables" at the same time.    So, if I want it to be a great competition gun, I do what is required to get there.   If I want to speculate on increasing future value to a general buyer (which I've never wanted to), I would do nothing to the gun but preserve it's factory condition as close to original as I can.


    Remember that competing hard with any of our guns will "use them up" fairly quickly - especially the wood furniture and metal finish.


    good luck, GJ

    • Like 1
  18. I usually grab one of my brass bars that I got from the local hardware store (3/8" or 1/2" usually work well).   Rarely need one longer than about 6 inches.

    Very cheap, and I don't care what it looks like or where it was manufactured.  If I bend it, "oh well, scrap box for you, buddy."


    Hundred dollar sight pushers?  Haven't needed one yet.


    good luck, GJ

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